TheForum

Curious as to what you would lose to add those cards? Maybe the Nighthowlers for Eidolons? Although having two different three drops with 1WW and 1BB casting costs could be sticky.

Since your curve is so low, have you thought of adding any extort cards? Blind Obedience would slow your opponent down and help out your Ethereal Armors. Crypt Ghast could also work. Not sure if that is trying to do too much but it seems like you might have extra mana laying around after like turn 4.

Yeah I would probably drop the Garruk. He is really good and can keep your hand flush with threats but for that much mana I fell like you'd rather play a Hydra or Xenagod instead. Domri and the courser should hopefully be enough to keep you hitting creatures on your draws.

-Bill

I was already strongly considering the Mistcutters considering our meta and I think its the right move to include them. I was running the Polis Crushers to dodge all the enchantment removal before but Mistcutter is just a better card and is still resilient.

I took out 4 sources of ramp and included the Coursers. I already run them in my enchantment deck and they are GREAT but I like to avoid repeating the same cards if possible, but in concert with Domri, they should keep me hitting lands and my hand filled with threats.

I like the curve of this much much more than my initial list. I think playtesting this list will give me a good idea as to which creatures to include more/less copies of.

Now I'm wondering if Garruk warrants inclusion or not? The ideal scenario is to cast him at turn 5/6, use his middle ability to throw out a creature but he really only has seven targets for that.

I would consider Courser of Kruphix. Can keep you hitting land drops and in combination with Domri can help keep you consistently drawing threats.

Nykthos may also be helpful. I don't know if I'd run a bunch of them but if you have big devotion for a Savageborn or Polukranos or even Clan Defience you could really do some damage to you opponents board. I agree with Boyf that Polukranos is the best 4 drop and you could run more than 2 since most likely it will be dealt with immediately. The only other 4 drop that might be good is Deadbridge Goliath. Aggressive costing with the scavenge bonus might be decent.

I am also having a little trouble with my Xenagod deck, but the Courser, Kalonian Hydra and Nykthos are the biggest things I am considering adding.

Something I am running that you might want one or two of is the Mistcutter Hydra. The haste and pro blue can be big in the right matchup. Which based on our combined deck stats blue is the most commonly played color in our meta.

-Bill

Polukranos is far and away the best four drop available to you; you could consider going above 2. -Boyf

I agree with Bill about Battle at the Bridge, I like the card in general but you want to be swinging with your vehicles, and if you play Grasp or something else, you dont need to have the Servo Exhibitions which frees up some cards.

I am assuming the goal of the deck is to drop vehicles and crew with with high power, low cost creatures, so I am not entirely sure Lone Rider is the best two drop.

I know they are expensive but Heart of Kiran would be a good addition as well.

Gideon is silly, please rip up that card. K, thanks.

Did a theoretical reworking of the deck to focus more on the ramp and less of a toolbox which I had inadvertently turned it into by trying to find solutions to every potential problem. 12 sources of ramp seems like a lot, but I really want to see 2 in the first two turns and be dropping my 5 cost cards on the third turn. The curve seems a bit wacky but I can cast the savage born hydra at four if I miss ramp or a land drop, and the four drop creatures that are available in this block/color combination are really underwhelming. I could use some suggestions for that spot. Any other input is greatly appreciated.

I think Gods Willing is just strictly better than Ajani's Presence. Protection saves you from Oblivion Rings and makes you unblockable if need be, and it scries.-Boyf

60% of the time it works everytime...

-Bill

I’ve always been of the mind that you shouldn’t need cards like Rest in Peace that are so specialized. Putting in more cards that are good in a variety of situations should be enough with what else you have already.

I’ll tell you what beats Avacyn (including your favorite, Obzedat), with a little anticipation, is counterspells. And counterspells are good against anything (except Thrun, Abrupt Decay, Supreme Verdict, Altered Ego, things cast with Cavern of Souls, Dragonlord Dromoka, Emrakul (the Aeons one), Gaea’s Revenge, Exquisite Firecraft, Loxodon Smiter, Pearl Lake Ancient, Prowling Serpopard, Mistcutter Hydra, things cast with Savage Summoning, Overwhelming Denial, Skylasher, Surrak Dragonclaw, Terra Stomper, Carnage Tyrant, Counterflux, and Sphinx of the Final Word). Other than those times, it works every time.

-Mike

Bill’s assessment of the deck is right on.

I agree with mystery man’s suggestions for salvaging the focus of this deck, but I LOVE your split deck ideas.

Troll:
Troll + Varolz + Pack Rat + Scavenge value cards = wow. My favorite value-scavenge card (with Varolz) that barely missed the cut in Jarad was Deadbridge Goliath. And hello, Desecration Demon. I’m not sure what the supporting cards should be, but you’ve got something here.

Vraska:
Vraska was built for a control deck, which your non-Troll half of your deck is a good start. If you want to be winning more games by assassination, control is the way to go.

-Mike

Unfortunately, overloading removes the targeting aspect of spells. Strive is the closest thing to what you’re thinking of.

I actually don’t have a strong feeling for or against your creature swap suggestion.

I do, however, think you might be onto something about the creature/spell ratio. I’d definitely go up to 4 Mizzium Skin and 4 Ajani’s Presence, for instance.

-Mike

I had thought of Secure the Wastes, but like you said, Alarm is better with low mana. I agree that he’ll always want to cast Dragon Fodder over it in turn 2, but if he doesn’t get one of those, he’ll want something to cast in turn 2.

If you removed Raise the Alarm and Lightning Strike for a Dictate and Secure the Wastes, you’d essentially be down to 8 2-drops (I’m not counting Secure the Wastes – a 1/1 for 2 mana is terrible). 8 cards at the 2 mana cost is way too few.

-Mike

Two more things:

1. No one wants this deck to get better.

2. Yes to all of your ideas above.

Would Phalanx Leader be a better inclusion for this deck than the Favored Hoplite and the single Fortune Hunter? If this deck has a heavy creature draw the Leader would make his limited number of spells more efficient.

Also, I don't remember, if Mizzium Skin is overloaded does it trigger heroic? It doesn't, correct?

As much as I used to say it, this list doesn't need Hero of Iroas only running the 4 Ordeals, but if you ever put in ordeals of Heliod I would recommend putting in some Heroes along with it.

-Bill

Not a bad thought at all. I hadn't thought of Secure the Wastes, because I was thinking low curve, but it would be bonkers in the right situation. We'll keep an eye on that. -Boyf

I agree with Boyce about the Chant. It just wouldn't do enough in too many games. I do, however, recommend some minor tweaks. I'd consider dropping the Manglers for another Jarad and 2 more land. This deck very much wants to hit 4 land on time, and 24 land is the standard amount to get you there. I know there are mana creatures that can help with this, but there are enough uses for extra mana that this isn't a problem. Plus, it's nice to get to attack with a big gyre sage rather than tap for mana if you can.

This deck could greatly benefit from scrylands, and maybe even a Rogue's Passage.

-Mike

The Geist would instantly make this deck so much better. That is one of the best cards from Innistrad block and is super annoying to deal with. I also really like Sleep. I've had a deck idea I've been ruminating on involving using Sleep to combo with Gideon's Avenger and Sunblast Angel. That list you have would be pretty good.

-Bill

I really like the changes to this deck. Dictate of Heliod is pretty great with the ease in which he can pump out tokens. It also seems like it will be much more consistent. I would maybe consider a third over the single Lightning Strike but I concede it may not be necessary.

Was Secure the Wastes a consideration for the Raise the Alarm slot. I know for 2-3 mana Alarm is better than Secure but I also think he would rather play Dragon Fodder or Hurdling Outburst over Alarm if he had both in his hand because of the synergy with the Rabblemaster. Secure the Wastes could be a late game mana sink that could really flip the balance of power in his favor and is still at instant speed. Only running 2 would make it less likely to be an inefficient draw in the early game. Just a thought.

-Bill

Also, what about Shrieking Affliction, if you're going to go the discard/control route?

-Mike