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It doesn't activate Livewire lash for two reasons. For one, Lash only triggers when the creature is hit with a spell, not an ability. Secondly, the sacrifice is done as an additional cost to the ability. This means that not only do you remove one loyalty counter from him, but you must ALSO sac a creature. Since it's a activation cost it does not target =]

[QUOTE=surewhynot]It doesn't activate Livewire lash for two reasons. For one, Lash only triggers when the creature is hit with a spell, not an ability. Secondly, the sacrifice is done as an additional cost to the ability. This means that not only do you remove one loyalty counter from him, but you must ALSO sac a creature. Since it's a activation cost it does not target =][/QUOTE]

You're right, Garruk, the Veil-Cursed's 2nd ability won't trigger Livewire Lash. Your explanations are slightly off though.

1. You're also right that the Lash will only trigger for spells. Livewire Lash triggers when the equipped becomes the target of the spell, though. So it will resolve before the spell that triggered it.

2. The sacrifice is part of the effect of the ability (notice "Sacrifice a creature." comes after the colon). You're right that it doesn't target a creature, but it's because the rules text for the effect doesn't use the word "target".

Both of these rulings can be found of the gatherer pages of their perspective cards.

[QUOTE=efinmiller]You're right, Garruk, the Veil-Cursed's 2nd ability won't trigger Livewire Lash. Your explanations are slightly off though.

1. You're also right that the Lash will only trigger for spells. Livewire Lash triggers when the equipped becomes the target of the spell, though. So it will resolve before the spell that triggered it.

2. The sacrifice is part of the effect of the ability (notice "Sacrifice a creature." comes after the colon). You're right that it doesn't target a creature, but it's because the rules text for the effect doesn't use the word "target".

Both of these rulings can be found of the gatherer pages of their perspective cards.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the clean up. I just answered in a sloppy way =P

[QUOTE=efinmiller]
2. The sacrifice is part of the effect of the ability (notice "Sacrifice a creature." comes after the colon). You're right that it doesn't target a creature, but it's because the rules text for the effect doesn't use the word "target".[/QUOTE]

OH MA GOD! Sacrifice isn't a cost. You can respond before a creature is sacrificed! /off topic/

Garruk Relentless

Thank you all for all of your help. =] Also, i do apologize for my lack of understanding of sead cards... as well as the inner workings of the game it self. Sadly... i'm still learning the game... and it's been three years now since starting. It just goes to show... one may have all the cards needed to play the game, but all this factered in means nothing if you don't play the cards right.

@surewhynot: Haha, no worries, it happens. This game has so many ins and outs that it's hard to keep track of sometime.

@Howlinger: No apology needed. We all have to learn sometime. This is what the M:TG community is here for :)

[QUOTE=dagbaker]OH MA GOD! Sacrifice isn't a cost. You can respond before a creature is sacrificed! /off topic/

Garruk Relentless[/QUOTE]

um... in this case... yes it is, because you have to SACRIFICE to activate the ability.

[QUOTE=Kazzong]um... in this case... yes it is, because you have to SACRIFICE to activate the ability.[/QUOTE]

Um... your wrong.

In the case of Garruk, the Veil-Cursed's 2nd ability, sacrificing a creature is part of the effect of the ability, not the cost.

Here is the rule showing how activated abilities are written:
[quote]602.1. Activated abilities have a cost and an effect. They are written as “[Cost]: [Effect.] [Activation instructions (if any).]”[/quote]

Here is the Oracle text for Garruk's 2nd ability:
[quote]-1: Sacrifice a creature. If you do, search your library for a creature card, reveal it, put it into your hand, then shuffle your library.[/quote]

See how "Sacrifice a creature." comes AFTER the colon?

If sacrificing a creature were part of an additional cost, the ability would use the terminology similar to "as an additional cost..." which it doesn't.

Please don't confuse a question that's already been settled. And if you think that something is incorrect, please do your homework first.

Um, except that if you don't sac, then you don't search. It activates the 2nd part of the ability. It is a cost to use it.

Once again...

Activated abilities are written [cost] : [effect], as the rule I quoted clearly states. The cost is stated first, then the effect. The two are separated by a colon.

As you can see from the Oracle text, which I also quoted, it says the cost is [-1]. Which means that to pay the cost, you must remove one (1) loyalty counter from Garruk.

Then there is a colon ( : )

After the colon is the effect. The first part of the effect says, "Sacrifice a creature."

Also, if you read the rulings from the Gatherer for Garruk, the Veil-Cursed, you find this:
[quote]The second ability of Garruk, the Veil-Cursed doesn't target a creature. However, when that ability resolves, you must sacrifice a creature if you control one.[/quote]

There. I used the Comprehensive Rule Book, Oracle text, and Gatherer rulings, and explained it as plainly as I can.

If you really have a counter-argument, lets see some proof to back it up. Otherwise, please take your tolling elsewhere.