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Testing around with the idea of Faithless Looting in a basic LED Dredge, running my usual preference for a Bloodghast Hybrid. I'm not seeing a challenge from the cage yet, it's just another obnoxious version of Leyline... Truth be told stuff like Faerie Macabre, Extirpate, and Surgical Extraction are more challenging to deal with for me. It's so far been my favourite design for Dredge I've run, more so than my Bazaar builds in Vintage even. If nothing else, the Innistrad block has offered Dredge amusing tactics in the form of the aforementioned Faithless Looting from Dark Ascension, but also Memory's Journey from Innistrad.
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Nice build. Never though of using Sun Titan instead of an Iona-like creature here. I guess it works better now that you use the Bloodghast-Paradise engine instead of Ichorid. What does Winds of Change do?
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Put Bridge from Below into the GY from the H. I'm gonna post a pic of my Stinkweed PIMP sometime...K Wnb?
I'm actually not using Bloodghast as a replacement for Ichorid(note: I still run two copies of each), it's more or less as Narcomoeba 3-5. In LED Dredge it works better this way in my personal experience, but a lot of people still run three Ichorid alongside a playset of Narcomoeba. Winds of Change is a neat little option that can act as many things, I can make a combo player dump the hand they've worked so hard to sculpt, I can use it as a turbocharged draw spell to Dredge like crazy, ect. It's a handy tool when you get to learn how to use it right. And I've always wanted a pimpsuited version of Putrid Imp for Dredge, but Stinkweed would probably be more epic. Feel free to do as you please so long as you keep it work safe man, unless mods/admins say otherwise about something, I generally say go for it.
I've had so many cards altered...Putrid Imp is on the list now. lol http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=293930 A new token deck for standard. I'd like to see your thoughts on it. :P There'll be one just above it too, which uses Faithless Looting a bit. I might get those last two in foil btw. ;)
I have a few alters I want done, but it's just not worth the cost to me unless it's something I KNOW I'm going to play no matter what. So basically Doomsday lol
Do you thing Gravecrawler has any potential in Dredge? Or is it too clunky?
It could, but there is only Zombie tokens, and you don't get it for free.
I've been toying around with the idea of using Gracecrawler, but I'm not sure how I feel about running it with a manabase this sketchy :/
Yeah. From what I've seen, most dredge decks have no problem getting a Zombie token out, and every time GC dies, he'll leave one. But the one mana could be used for much better things in Dredge. Random thought: I definitely think it's good that Wizards banned Grave-Troll and Dread Return in Modern. That prevents dredge from wrecking the format. Most of the key dredge cards are from post 8th anyway.
In a version less focused on Dread Return I think GC could be really really good, but right now it's such a powerful move that I can't get behind dropping the idea of busting out FKZ or Sun Titan. If something happened that actually bothered me about the idea of running those two, I'd probably start working in that direction actually. I'm hoping that the leave it as is though, since I personally find Dredge to be no worse a deck than any Fish variant. And I'm all for the ban on Grave-Troll in Modern, I'm not sure I like the ban on DR though. It makes sense at the start of the format, but I think a slow rolling Dredge, like with GC, could be really neat in the format.
This looks really nice. Faithless looting is a great card for Dredge. I have a few thoughts for you to consider, but they are minor because this deck already looks really solid. Personally I don't know that I would go through the trouble of putting in Bloodghast. You are a little light on mana as it is even with the LED. I personally would cut them and maybe replace 2 of your Undiscovered Paradise for 2 or 3 Gemstone Mine. Maybe sneak a single Darkblast in place of a Golgari Thug. Never really seen Sun Titan in dredge before but now I am wondering why not. It seems great with the deck. Great build, good luck with the deck!
A lot of people are with you on the Bloodghast thing, but it's something I run due to personal preference/experience. It wasn't worth it in standard non-LED Dredge, that I have to admit, but in LED Dredge I've always wanted at least two. For a while I had a version that ran the full playset of them instead of Ichorid, but more and more I find they work better as just Narcomoeba 4-5. Darkblast is a card I've had a troubled history with in Dredge, it has won me some seriously sketchy games, but there are just as many times where I'd rather have that extra Thug so I could dredge a little deeper :/ The manabase is a bit light, it's just I can't really find anything I'm willing to cut right now. I thought about scratching a copy of Careful Study, but I haven't tested nearly as much as I would like. Sun Titan is amazing in Dredge, but most people who don't play the Vintage version with him and Bazaar of Baghdad just pass him over. In some games when you're playing a slow dredge he can win a game from bringing back an Undiscovered Paradise for Bloodghast fuel, or by popping up a LED so you can flashback Faithless Looting.
Yeah those were just possible suggestions, I can certainly see your choices working out great. You can see how it plays out with and without the Careful Study. I personally think that it needs to stay in. Even with Faithless having flashback, most of the time you will probably play it like a regular study. Dredge has always wanted more than 4 study's so I think 2 study's and 4 faithless (with possible flashback) should run very nice. I would almost like to see 2 more study's but there is nothing to trim as is.
So I've done a bit of testing(as much as I could barring school), and while it can play without one or both of Studies, it's just not as smooth. The thought of playing more Studies is startling in how unappealing I find it, that I HAVE tested more extensively, and it is not as pretty as one would hope. It's like you say, there's nothing to trim that doesn't negatively impact the overall design. I really do still like the idea of running Darkblast, but as a sideboard card against some of the more threshy control decks, smashing down a Delver, Image, or a Bob can be a huge hit against them.
I've been looking at Gravecrawler, and I've noticed it would work VERY well with Vengevine in dredge, P Imp is a zombie!! :O I'm gonna post a deck that I'm starting to put together, with Gravecrawlers and dredge...
no vengevine believe me its worth it. i lost to a deck like this but i've beaten it too grave crawler works really well with bridge from below check out my cranial killing deckhttp://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=311148 also note even without the crawlers and vengevines this is a really solid build
What do you think of Avacyn, Griselbrand and Gisela for Dread Return targets?
So I don't like Ichorid, but I don't love Ghast. What do I do?