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Updated version of this --> http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=217217 <-- deck. I decided just to make a new deck list for it as that one is cluttered with all my revision posts and win/loss records. For the curious, check it out to see how this evolved! As with that deck, though, I will report wins and losses here. Cataloging that REALLY helped me figure out where this deck failed. 10/11: I'm setting this deck aside. Thank you everyone who tried to help me make this deck stable, the suggestions kept me afloat. With a week until States, however, if I want any chance at being competitive, I've realized that this will not be the deck. So, until later. *stamps deck ON HIATUS* 10/10: Deck adjusted to what it was during this past FNM (with the exception of a GQ which was changed to an Island directly after the tournament). Also, match summary at the bottom of the posts. MVP's = Phyrexian Metamorph and Feeling of Dread. -2 Sunblast Angel, +Sun Titan. Yeah, switched two 6CMC for... two 6CMC. When I've been complaining of mana issues for weeks. Smart move, it was not. >.< Granted, Sunny WAS a better card that the angel, but he was just as likely to sit in my hand when I got color/man screwed. Both will probably be leaving the deck whether I play this at States or not. SB: -1 Flashfreeze, +1 Sword of War and Peace. -2 Due Respect, +2 Marrow Shards; -1 Stony Silence, +1 Torpor Orb. Need more Orbs in there somewhere and the Shards were for the RDW decks I din't play against. I sided them in against W/g Humans, but never drew them. 10/3: Holy crap! Never expected to hit the front page with this. Shows what happens when I go away for the weekend. XD Anyway, below is the build I played with on Friday; I'll post match-ups below. I got a few suggestions from my opponents and definitely saw what works and what doesn't. Important note: Abolishers are staying in. Oh god, are they staying in. 9/30: -1Think Twice, +1 Ponder, -2Phantasmal Image & -1 DoJ from the SB, +3 Stony Silence. The ability to shut down Equipment and Birthing Pod? YES PLEASE. Also, there's a good chance I'll be playing this at State's on October 15th. Any thoughts on how I can improve my chances?
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I like this deck quite a bit. I'm just a sucker for U/W I guess, especially blue. Mmmm Gideon and his lackeys are so chill!
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I know what you mean, I find myself building a lot of U/W, too. XD It's hard not to!
Would you mind giving my T2 U/W deck a look? I'm new to the format, and any thoughts would help me out a great deal!
Shit here's the link haha and one more comment for you!! http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=237962
LOL On my way to do so! :)
Love Me some tap decks ^.^ Feeling of Dread is SUCH and AMAZING Card! Good build i need to go update my Tap deck now HAHA
The fun part is going to be relearning the timing of this deck. Since you can only play Sleep and Narcolepsy during your main phases, it's easy to know when to play them. Frost Breath and FoD are both instants... Timing is going to be a HELL of a lot more important. Thanks for the comments! :D That does make me think, though... Last night people were telling me to either run Think Twice OVER Ponder, or at least run more TT. Anyone else have comments on that?
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A lot of people are making a huge deal about Think Twice. I honestly think it's being vastly overrated. I mean, yes drawing two cards is great, and it's instant speed is pretty impressive, but drawing those 2 cards is going to cost 5 mana total. I understand that it is doing double duty as a single card, but IMO Ponder is miles away from Think Twice. Ponder only costs ONE. And it let's you reorganize or shuffle. Those 2 mana could be better used for a Mana Leak, right? I can see the appeal of having a Leak and Think in your hand, passing your turn two to see what your opponent does, and having options of things to cast on their turn, but Think could very possibly end up sitting in your hand for who knows how long depending on how the game plays out. Think Twice isn't bad by any means, I just personally think that Ponder is much better. They're quite different, but the reorganizing/shuffling effect is just too good, and has won me MANY games. There's my 2 cents! I'm interested to see what other people have to say about this card; it's being talked about a quite a bit!
Think twice is nice cuz its Instant speed you can end of turn it during there turn and even flash it back during there turn. I played in a few drafts during the prerelease and that was a card i did get during one draft and it was a major advantage in the card draw game but in standard id run ponder.
Desperate Ravings is the big deal draw card!!
Yeah, but Red is conspicuously absent from this deck. XD I'll admit, that card did have me staring at it a bit.
BLUE WHITE!!!!!!! AHHHHHHHH -like-
Initial playtesting begun last night. I went 2 and 2 against a mono-white Puresteel/Living Weapon deck. From that small sample, I'm not sure I like Think Twice in here at all. I'm still having the same mana issues I had in this deck's previous incarnation, so have three land free is a premium, not a luxury. I suppose the easy answer would be to just add more land, especially since this is supposed to be control, but that means cutting something essential, too. Then again, if I never see a sixth land anyway, a lot less becomes "essential"... >.>
Throw in 1 or 2 more mana, and trade Think Twice for Ponder. Think Twice is just completely outdone by Ponder, IMO. Sure instant speed and flashback are nice, but Ponder's cost and reorganization/shuffle effects make it much better.
Definitely Ponder over Think Twice. The mana cost is what sways me first, then the rearranging of the library. Control (IMO any WU deck is control) shouldn't only control the opponent, but itself too and Ponder does exactly that. I'm more of an agro player, so I can only make decisions on WU from what I've faced against and I've always been more worried about the draw off a Ponder (and Preordain, but that's out) over strait draw.
Excellent points and change made. I'll probably be switching one of the six-costers for a land, too, but I'll do that tonight before FNM and see if it works.
Glad to be of some form of help :) 23 lands (IMO) should be enough lands. I run 20 in almost all my decks (17 in my Goblin deck) and I've not had any problems with land. But that could just be me :p Thanks for reminding me, I need to reconstruct one of my decks for tonight (we're playing Standard tonight). It's still strange to see my sister's name on this site o_o
Yeah, maybe I just have bad luck with the draw. XD Any thoughts about the proposed changes I've listed in the description? I've had this UN all over the web for 15-ish years, but I always find it cool to hear about people who actually have the name.
Honestly man, as I see it, it's either Gideon OR Sunblast, not both. Currently with both of them in along with Frosty (which you need to keep in...it's so good) your deck has a LOT of mana-burden, which is most likely why you're running into speed/mana issues. Mana burden is an intangible thing...but it can make or break a deck. With that said, I think Sunblast should be the one to go. Yeah, it's pretty devastating when it hits, but destroying already tapped down creatures is kinda redundant.
It's devastating when it hits and something IS tapped. That was the problem I ran into on Friday. Sunblast is meant to act as a Day to their side of the field. Once that night I had to play it with NOTHING tapped (needed the beef) and a few times it only killed a couple creatures. Not very good that. :/ And that's assuming it was cast at all. I think I'm agreeing with you. I hate to lose creatures, but if I can't play those creatures than it doesn't make a difference. On that note... what do you think of Deceiver Exarchs in here? Are they worth it? Would they be the final piece that warrants Venser's return to the deck, even as a one-of? Or am I better off with more control/land?
Better off without them really. They're not bad...but it's their power for cheesy combos that led to their popularity more than anything else =/
Ha! That's a good way to put it. I'll have to think about what should go in, then. Possibly Solemn Simulacrum for mana/draw/fun target for Metamorph. 4th Ponder, 4th Metamorph, 3rd ORing... some options to play with. I'm not in a rush to make this control, but I need something in there.
nice deck you should check this out and HELP me with it! http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=236813
drop to 1 sunblast
what about adding sleep?
I'm sure he would've had Sleep in here if only Sleep was legal in standard!
Sleep was in the original, pre-Innistrad build. Click the link at the top. It was a BOMB and I miss it hard. >.<
I have a pretty similar deck but am having a huge problem with keeping my avenger out there, either he gets burned imediatly or doom bladed if he has more then a couple counters on him... was thinking spellskite?
Having an Abolisher out is surprisingly devastating to burn/black kill. If you can keep them from killing the creature on your turn then it's easier to defend said creature on THEIR turn. However, yes, Avenger draws kill like a magnet. :/ Spellskite IS good protection, if it fits in your build. Being able to redirect that burn spell/O-Ring/bounce/Doom Blade can be pretty nice.
huh, i was unaware it wasnt standard legal, my bad =p
This seems like a version of my tap deck aside from the blue cards.
Mono-white tap is very doable, especially with that new Priest that just came out. The Gideon-core of the deck is pretty much essential in any version of the build, so they all look similar in that regard.
Im diggin this deck for sure. Seems like you could wipe the floor with some of the new standard decks that arent quite finished, or are in need of some advice, like mine. Its a basic blueblack zombie tribal with a hint of mil to get some zombies in the graveyards. Have a look and tell me what you think :) http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=240282
When it comes time I would replace frost breath with feeling of dread. That card works miracles.
Frost Breath is gone, replaced by mana and a 4th Leak. And I was already running 4 FoD. That card is SO amazing.
i like this... bad ass sir.... bad ass... the name is funny as hell also..cudo's
Ha, thanks!
So! 9/30's FNM report: Ended the night at 3/3/0, losing in Top 8 when a Birthing Pod deck ran right over me. To be fair, he IS 3rd in the WORLD for points this season (no joke, I saw the list afterwards) and I already knew it was going to be a tough match up. Round 1: 2-1, Against mono-black Zombies. He Praetor's Grasped both my Swords in game two, but even that wasn't good enough when he couldn't attack me. The win he got was when he got out two Obliterators and I had... one Lawkeeper and nothing else. :x Round 2: 1-2, Birthing Pod. Stony Silence is my new best friend. However, I just CAN'T recover from Days/Sunblast the way a Pod deck does, so... I would wipe the field and he would put out three creatures. Erk. I stalled him to a crawl, though and ALMOST had him game 3. It was too fun to get that close, I didn't even feel bad about the loss. Round 3: 2-0, Mono-black again, though I can't remember the build. It was an easy win, especially when the Swords came in game 2. Round 4: 1-2, Mono-white Tempered Steel. Days and Divine Offering made life very inconvenient for him. :D Offering an Inkmoth is amusing. Unfortunately, Dispatch was also very inconvenient for ME. Round 5: 2-0 G/B infect. I rolled right over him. Seriously. Game 1 he couldn't recover after I Day'd the field and Game 2 meant Swords on the field and O-Ring on Skittles. :3 Top 8, Round 1: 0-2, another, BETTER, even FASTER Pod deck. He murdered me. Normally, I hate playing against him because he can be an arrogent ass, no matter how deserved the ego might be. BUT he was so good natured about both games and we had fun talking about the new, scary builds coming out, so, again, it's hard to feel too bad about the fact that he raped my deck. XD
Like the idea. Also look on the android market for mtg deck ideas. Always being updated and looking for new decks to be added.
Android market? Heh?
Damn, I was hoping this would be a tribal donkey un-set control deck. One can dream...
Mercedes. Where are you playing FNM? Lancaster PA?? Great deck BTW.
Nope! Central Maine. :) Someone in Lancaster playing a similar deck? And thanks!
Some what similar, and we have a guy thats also ranked in the top few in the country. Also arrogent as hell.. Looking like B/W control and Pod are going to be the decks to beat.
My sideboard needs to be adjusted for Pod and Solar Flare. Stony Silence slows Pod down, but not enough. One of those Swords is going to be War and Peace instead of Feast and Famine; I'm thinking about Torpor Orbs, which should effectively slow both down even further and a Nihil Spellbomb or two would effectively neuter Sun Titan and Snapcaster if timed right.
I'm liking the card redirect for this deck, there are just so many possibilities where it would give you the advantage or secure a win
Too defensive. If I wanted something like that, I'd probably run Spellskite. I would say Redirect isn't effective, but I'd rather fit in something that either speeds me up or makes me more aggressive.
What do you think about Swiftfoot boots? Hexproof + Haste, cheap to equip plus easy counter on Avenger if you draw your lawkeeper
hmmmmmm everything seems to come together nicely but hmm Dispatch keeps coming to mind seems to fit in this deck ? and late game if u get ur artifacts out it ll help remove bombs no ?
Dispatch would be awesome it I was running more artifacts. Sadly, with only six, the chance of having Metalcraft is slim to none and that makes the spell pretty useless.
You should try running the vensser as well... Bouncing the Titan (or anything for the matter) and then the -8 (exile permanent each time you cast a spell? Yes please... Flashback becomes ridiculously powerful for a late game close match!
You're not the first to suggest Venser go back into the deck and you probably won't be the last. With the suggestions piling up, though, I'm starting to think it really might BE time to slot him in. And if the Angels Do come out...
You should add vector Asp just so you can tap that Asp!
I agree with the rest, Venser should be back in. Can also refresh the tumble magnet counters when it enters the battlefield again. http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=241883
Venser would be good if it wasn't for the 5 cost, it would slow the deck WAY down. If anything, she would need something earlier game => 3 cmc. Spellskites, Deceiver Exarch, something like that maybe.
Not going to do a whole report for Friday, but I'm adjusting the build above after this to reflect what I played. Final: 3-2-0, bumped down to 10th due to tie-breakers. Not that I would have made it past round one of the finals, but yeah. My wins were against two black decks (I am definitely seeing a pattern here), which were unrefined piles of zombies with very few tricks, and a G/U attempt at graveyard tricks that was low on creatures and functioned rather poorly. :/ I almost felt bad for beating one guy; it was his first tournament and he obviously hadn't been playing too long. My other two games were Solar Flare and White-splash-Green Humans. >.> 2-0 them, both matches. The best could do was stall them, unfortunately. Torpor Orb helps a good deal in the same way Stony Silence helped against Bant Pod: Stops a few of their main sequence of spells, but doesn't cut them off completely. W/g outruns me, Torpor Orb only neuters Blade Splicer and Champion of the Parish. Solar Flare has too many ways around everything I throw at them, not to mention getting crreatures faster and in larger quantities. My confidence in the deck as a States-worthy build is shaky. It might be better if I had more time to play test and adjust, but with only a day or more a week so far and only a week until States.... yeah. >.<
Sleeved up proxied versions of the 4 top deck types we're likely to see at States so that we could do some last minute cramming. And after my first two games, getting trounced (again) by Solar Flare I had to finally give in to the reality of the situation: Taps, in any variation of the above, will not be competitive in Standard at this time. There's always a chance that something my come in the next two Innistrad expansions that will make it viable again, but as it stands right now, every major winning build just runs right over me. For now, I'm setting this aside. I'll come back to it, either when something more board-effective comes in furture sets or, possibly, for Modern/Extended. Losing Sleep and Narcolepsy really hurt this deck and it doesn't look recoverable. :/ So... Temper Steel at States for me!