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Oh she'll find you the book you want...and charge you in blood for each page you turn :P This is a B/R variation on the Maralen the Mornsong + Bloodchief Ascension + Archive Trap combo, focusing mainly on burn for aggressive play and board control. I created this deck in conjunction with Kharay1977's Speedmill deck; I believe my version achieves much the same effect in speed/consistency of the combo, however I prefer to play even more aggressively, using burn spells to destroy creatures and activate the Ascension more quickly. Obviously, this style is slightly more vulnerable to removal; however, I feel it will fare better against the aggressive rush decks many of my friends play. I'm still working on balancing the cards; I feel as if the deck is just about there, but there's something missing... Any suggestions for better spells to possibly replace Blightning or Sign in Blood would be much appreciated, as well as useful additions to my sideboard :)
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Any suggestions to increase speed and consistency would be much appreciated :D Also not sure how you could possibly make this work in standard. Take out Demonic Tutor to make it Legacy, and Dark Ritual to drop to Extended. But that takes away a lot of speed :( If I can improve it a bit to make it a consistent t4 win, I'll buy the cards just to laugh at all my nerd friends :)
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Can't make it work at all in Standard - http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Printings.aspx?multiverseid=152546 And she really is key to the whole thing - for her ability to force people to search their library. And the alternative to her, although a bit ... strange, is Fertilid ( http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Printings.aspx?multiverseid=220452 ), which also isn't exactly Standard. ;)
Lol... How cheap... xD i like it...But i doibt you will get two dark rituals in a hand xD but the archive trap alone with the maralen is funny Plz look at my 2 turn win/wall tribal which should still be on newest xD
Lol is right. I don't usually get turn 2, but as long as I get 1 dark ritual and maralen its usually turn 3 or 4. Avoiding mana flood, always triggers around 5/6. Still trying to make it more consistent. I like that Rite of Flame, might try adding that. And yes your deck is hilarious xD
Good to see you also found the turn 3 kill, which already was present in my version. Regarding the legality of the turn 3 kill, yes, it's completely legal. It will work just fine. I like the idea of Lilliana in your version, but, I'm not too sure on her mana cost. I prefer to keep mana cost very low in most decks I build. A little suggestion for your deck, Reverberate ( http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=234705 ). As you noticed in my version I use Twincast. Obviously the primary method of winning is going to be the drain life of the Ascension. But in case I play against someone with a mechanic to prevent the loss of life or something, milling their library really hard (by copying the Trap and thus casting it twice for just 2 mana) is another way of getting there quickly. Just think about it... 2 x (Trap + Reverberate / Twincast)... that's already 52 cards. Enough to kill the deck. Let me know what you think, curious to hear your thoughts on furthering the goal of my Speedmill, Maralen / Trap combo. Another card to consider - Glimpse the Unthinkable ( http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=83597 ). For the record, by the way, I don't have the deck in reality yet, I'm still designing it and I'm actually also a bit stumped for money. But, when I land a new job, I'm definitely building it in some fashion or another.
Correction: I notice you actually realized the speedkill is one turn faster. Why didn't I consider casting Maralen and the Ascension both on Turn 1? Ah well... good one of you to point out.
Hm. I'll think about Reverberate; if nothing else it's a good way to double the damage/mill. Glimpse the Unthinkable is a very good card for mill, but for now I want to avoid making this a 3-color deck, it would only slow down the Bloodchief + Maralen. I agree with Liliana being a little high mana. I originally had Demonic Tutor (just for fun, it makes the deck way faster) but considering how expensive and banned that card is........ In any case, Liliana is mostly for late-game in case I don't find a Maralen. Although I might get her out early with a Dark Ritual... As you can see, my version is a lot less focused on mill than on burn damage. I feel like an actual game with this deck will be more about board-control: killing of the opponent's creatures, and I'll get in a Blightning when I have the chance. The Ascension allows you to win the game while focusing on creatures rather than you're opponent, which is why it's so widely useful. For me, the Archive Trap is really just a surprise kill. Really, with four Archive Traps you already have potential to mill they're entire deck, and if you can find them with Maralen you can cast them all at once or in stages. I think I'll add Reverberate, though, as an extra chance of doubling mill/damage. And no, I don't own any of these yet either xD I'm relatively new to magic, so I prefer to build decks on here and get it down to exactly what I want before I spend money on cards. But considering how cheap most of the cards are, I will probably buy this deck once I get bored of my latest Standard deck :)
3 colours can work just fine with the proper lands. Although those do make the deck more expensive to buy. ;) Have a new look at mine, by the way, I changed some things and added a useful sideboard. One that I may still need to think on some more, I want to find a better way to drop Child quickly and then have it die quickly. As a means of board control. Or rather, as a means for countering board control. ;) Reason I did go with Trap AND Twincast - draw chances, mostly. But, also, so far I haven't found anything more useful, at least in my version and this way, it can dish out so much mill. At the moment it's 144 cards. ;) Unless I move an Elixir from SB to the deck. Then it's... well, infinite really. ;)
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I don't like how Reverberate is working with the deck. I usually don't have the mana to cast it (I find I rely a lot more on black mana early on, despite the amount of red burn in this deck, which is why I took out the mountains) and when I do, it's not really worth it just to copy a bolt/doom blade. Copying an Archive Trap is fun, but usually unnecessary. I'm actually reconsidering Isochron Scepter instead...early on, I could Imprint a bolt, allowing me to cast burns or kill creatures with black mana, or later I could copy a doom blade for extra board control.... I think it's better that way that I can recycle it and tap it on an opponent's turn instead :)
Well, I suppose maybe it wouldn't work ideally for you. I still think not copying the Archive is a waste, I mean - 26 cards gone for just 2 mana is just so incredibly wicked. Not to mention the fact you just spent just 2 mana to cause 52 loss of life and gain 52 life (assuming the quest on the Ascension has completed). Those are some wicked returns for just 2 mana. The Scepter... could be interesting indeed, if you can drop it early on. Very early on indeed. By the way, have another look at mine, I changed some stuff, have a look at my own bottom comment for a small summary. I like where we're going with these - race you to actually building these decks? Would be wonderful to pit them against each other. :P See who has the more viscious version.
*FACEPALM* Just realized how much of an idiot I am...been trying to find a good tutor ability to replace the over-priced, banned, yet oh-so-enticing Demonic Tutor. So far, with a little tweaking of mana and balancing the spells, the deck consistently churns out turn 4-6 kills, except when I can't find Maralen. Went back to my crappy Vampire EDH experiment.....found Beseech the Queen. It's cheap on BidWicket, and it should solve my consistency issues. It won't speed up the deck, but it should guarantee Maralen's presence by turn 4, or it can speed up finding an Ascension. Realistically, there is no way to speed up the deck; a turn 2-3 kill relies on drawing a Dark Ritual and a Maralen, and not wasting time tutoring. With four in the deck, that's the best I can do, and it does happen every so often. Beseech the Queen is just a compromise between the high-budget, low-mana Demonic Tutor and the low-budget, too-high-mana Diabolic Tutor. We'll see how it goes, but I'm hoping this deck will be finished after a few more minor edits.
Beseech the Queen is a good option indeed. Too bad about the converted mana cost condition. Otherwise it'd be perfect if you pulled an opening hand with 2 Dark Rituals and Beseech. ;) So you could have Maralen out by Turn 2.
Yes, its annoying, but if nothing else it helps me find a bloodchief. There really is no way to guarantee Maralen by turn 3 without Demonic Tutor - 4 Maralens and 4 Dark Ritual is the best I can do, I think. Gonna look into some other cards with Cycling abilities... Otherwise, for now I'm happy with turn 5-6 kill and decent board control :)
I think I am going to buy some Beseech the Queen and Vedalken AEthermage. Both of you have good ideas of how to try and search for Maralen. Also with Beseech the Queen you can go for either Maralen or Bloodchief Ascension. I don't know if I will incorporate them yet but I would like to at least own them just in case.
UPDATE: After playing with a few creatures and Diabolic Intent the way Kharay tried it, I decided it wasn't worth taking that much away from the existing spell-based deck. Instead, I made a few changes for more dual-purpose spells: -Replaced Doom Blade with Hideous End - more expensive but it activates the Bloodchief -Added Magma Jet - went through a few burn spells before I found this, not fond of 2-mana cost but the scrying feature helps to cycle for Maralen while board-controlling or activating Bloodchief, like a reverse Sign in Blood -Added Lightning Greaves - had forgotten they gave shroud, right now they're my only protection for Maralen, I'm more concerned with speed so we'll see how the deck fares before I decide how many to add Please post any comments on the spells I'm using, suggestions for better land, or how to improve consistency, as they would be much appreciated :)
Added Highway Robber to sideboard - expensive, but its a creature in case I need it, and another way to drain life. Something to consider, though I don't know if it will make the final cut. Culling the Weak is another powerful mana source, but I don't think I'll be able to use it without dumping most of the burn and turning this into a creature-based deck.
Misery Charm - http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=39466 Strongarm Tactics - http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=26349 Cheap ways of (hopefully) making sure you satisfy the conditions for the counters on Ascension.
So far, I feel like this deck is almost finished, but it just needs SOMETHING more... I found the lands I wanted, so that seems to work pretty consistently now, and with 4 Maralen/Ascension sample hands are winning consistently by turn 5. However, I feel like there's something missing; anything I could do to increase speed in searching/scrying/cycling the deck, or any useful defensive items, would be very helpful right now. I'm running out of ideas, but I believe Blightning and Sign in Blood, while very cool and useful cards, are the weakest spells in the deck right now, and I'd be more than willing to trade them out if I can find a more helpful card. That or any suggestions for sideboard additions, mostly defensive spells to face different opposing decks, would be much appreciated. C'mon, somebody, help me out :)
Some cards for your consideration, none of them really fitting what you described, but who knows: - Hissing Miasma ( http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=96922 ) - Rain of Gore ( http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=107358 ) - Contaminated Ground ( http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=193608 )
Hm. I don't think Hissing Miasma will really help that much, for less mana I'd rather just play a Blood Seeker but I already tried that; it's not enough to be really worth it. But I will sideboard the other two for consideration, not sure whether they'll make the final cut or not. Rain of Gore is a potential counter to lifegain decks, however I don't think its safe in this situation; essentially, if that's on the field I can't play Bloodchief Ascension or we'll both die. Contaminated Ground, however...if played early, that's a good way to ensure 2 damage on an opponent's turn, plus it could be a frustrating lockout for some of my friend's decks, although a lot of them play black unfortunately :( I'll think about switching that for some Blightnings while I look into other cards.
True, Rain of Gore would be risky. But, well... as long as you keep your opponent at a lower life total than yourself, you'll be fine. And since your version is mostly about hammering out the Bloodchief's quest counters fast anyway... Anyhow, were just some random cards I found while looking for some improvements for your version. I'm a bit stumped on my own version so decided to take a crack at some possible improvements for yours.
Did you think about Browbeat? And congrats on making front page with this comment!!!;)
I tried something like this in Legacy and honestly the biggest problem is Maralen herself allowing your opponent to grab exactly what they need from their deck in order to prevent you from getting any further into your combo. I did win one game on turn 3 but besides that nothing. Once word got through the room about what I was playing I didn't stand a fighting chance. It's back to Black Suicide for me!
3 things. 1. The deck *can* kill turn 2, during your opponent's 2nd end step. T1: Blood Crypt -> Dark Ritual -> Dark Ritual -> Maralen -> Bloodchief Ascension get 1 counter in their end step. T2: Magma Jet/Lightning Bolt/Sign in Blood them for counter number 2. their turn in end step get the 3rd counter, Archive Trap. 2. If their deck runs any disenchants *at all* this deck will fail. 3. Noble Benefactor is another way to pull this trick off. Personally I think the deck is safer (from point 2) in a control deck with Countersquall and Undermine. Each to their own, I suppose.
Noble Benefactor: MAY search. It is not mandatory. Maralen's search however IS mandatory. The only other approach to making it mandatory would be to use Fertilid ( http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=220452 ). Which is an interesting approach as well, mind you. Perfectly fine approach. It's just different. The Maralen approach accomplishes 2 things at once though - it forces the search and it completes the quest on Bloodchief Ascension at the same time.
I realize the combo itself has its weakness, as with any combo deck, removal can kill you. And yes, once my friends find out how it works, they will fight to prevent it. I doubt this deck would make it through a tournament, but it would be great where I play. Also, this is part of why I went for the more aggressive burn approach. Kharay's and BrainDamage's versions fight hard to protect the combo. Mine is less defensive, but can win on its own without dropping the Archive Trap. Enough burn and board control means I can potentially finish them, especially if I bring in BSZ. Naturalizing the Ascension would make that much harder, but that's what I save Dash Hopes for. @Kharay and others: Comments on the balance of the deck, whether I need more counterspells, etc. to make it less likely to fail. Here's a few I've been thinking of adding: Molten Influence - counter unless they pay 4 life, I already have Dash Hopes but that's extra defense if I need it Imp's Mischief - another way to avoid removal, at least against Maralen, but will it be effective and how costly is it to my life? Shunt - safer than Imp's Mischief, but the extra mana makes it harder to pull off Breaking Point - destroy all creatures unless an opponent pays 6 life. A powerful alternative to BSZ, at probably lower mana cost, but it can be countered...however, the heavy life cost means in 1v1 I'll finish them next turn if I don't die... Volcanic Fallout - another alternative board-wipe, can't be countered, but it will only hit toughness 2 or less unless I help it out with a Lightning Bolt Thanks for the defeatist attitudes by the way, and the comments telling me what I already know.
"Thanks for the defeatist attitudes by the way, and the comments telling me what I already know." -- If you don't want feedback, don't post the deck on MTGVault.com. Imp's Mischief - Fine card in your deck, very fine. As long as you reserve it for the most immediate and important attacks made against your version of the deck, Disenchants, Lightning Bolts, Swords to Plowshares, Go for the Throats, etc, etc, then the cost to your life will be manageable. Especially considering the fact that you will pull off the Bloodchief Ascension quest fairly quickly and thus will have a means to recover life lost. Breaking Point - I think you'll have enough in the BSZ. Let's say you're playing against a life gainer of some type, or a deck that is capable of preventing the damage of Breaking Point (which isn't very hard to do). Sure, Breaking Point is cheaper to use than BSZ, but... what you also need to remember is that you don't need to pump in a lot of mana for it to be effective. Here's why - if you really need to wipe the board of a massive number of creatures, those are probably going to be smaller creatures. Sure, it's easy enough to create an infinite large army of infinitely large creatures, but, seriously, if you play against such a deck, you're doomed to begin with. Most commonly, if you need mass creature removal/destruction/obstruction, they're going to be tiny creatures. Weenie. So... just drop 1 or 2 -1/-1 counters on them with BSZ and the most immediate threat is over. For larger creatures you already have direct, single target creature removal. One thing you may want to consider though - Diabolic Edict. Against those decks and creatures that you can't remove because they're protected. Just a thought. Volcanic Fallout I like, actually. Again, most commonly if you really need to hit a lot of creatures at once, they're going to be smaller creatures. Take care of that last big one they have with a Diabolic Edict, Go for the Throat or... whatever.
-3 Sign in Blood, +1Blightning, +2 Terminate.
Was just about to add Terminate :) I've been thinking about replacing Sign in Blood, I'm also not sure about Blightning just because the higher cost makes it less useful in my opening hand...but it's such a great card...what are your thoughts on that? Why increase Blightning?
sweet deck man. Anyone wanna check out mine and give me some advice thanks http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=167430
Nice deck but I think I like the speedmill one a bit better :s Check out my infect deck I'm trying to make better? :D http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=165032
Great deck man, I love how despite it being B/R it has elements of Blue to it using Magma Jet and Dash Hopes. This would be an amazing combo to pull off in front on some friends :)
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Great deck. Might I suggest Pain Magnification for that little extra damage. Check out my deck: Library Lockdown. I took your main idea and gave it a little twist.
Sorry for the angry outburst everyone; I was just irritated that my first deck finally makes the home page, and the first two comments are "this will never work it sucks forget about it". Please, I understand that the combo, like any combo deck, has its weakness, and this version might be more vulnerable to removal. However, don't just tell me "it wont work if your opponent has any removal *at all* " - at least give a positive suggestion on how to make it better. But thank you to everyone who did liked it or made a recommendation. In response to some of those: Removed Sign in Blood, it was a good card to start but added Terminate instead for cheaper anti-ramp. Also sideboarded Volcanic Fallout, thanks Kharay for clearing that up. I think you're right, if I ever did need to wipe bigger creatures I'll use Terminate and most opponents would rather pay the 6 life if they're swinging for a kill, but at least Volcanic can't be countered. Also added Imp's Mischief for more protection, though I'll need to work on the balance between defense and damage. Pain Magnification....not essential, but a great addition to the deck. I like it. Between this and Blightning, I'll have much more potential to take down opponents even if they wreck the combo, so it's an alternative to adding more protection. Thing is, I don't have that many effects that deal three damage except Bolt and Blightning, which is higher mana and I don't think I'll use it often. Pain Magnification doesn't trip from Maralen because she doesn't "deal damage"...it's another way to go, but it takes me away from the combo and will probably slow me down. Should I sideboard it and extra Blightning as an alternative win method? Opinions on this?
I still don't get how you avoid Path to Exile / Lightning Bolt / Go for the Throat / whatever else is in standard for removal. They get to search a card, so surely they search up a creature destruction card and bomb Maralen with it. You're tapped out (because you paid for Maralen that turn) so you can't Dash Hopes on the removal. Do people you play with not have any creature removal in their deck? I'd love for this deck to work, but I don't see how to get around that obstacle... For additional triple-damage-dealers, I guess you could consider running Lust for War and Searing Blaze... but nah.
Order of play: - Play Lightning Greaves - Play Maralen. - Due to priority be able to respond first to Maralen entering the battlefield, equip her with Greaves. Done... Sure, they can also have stuff in their deck to remove the Greaves, but honestly... it is completely impossible to build a deck that is safe from every other deck out there. There is simply no such thing as an unbeatable combo.
Thank you Kharay. As said before, combo decks are a lot of fun and I tend to love the possibilities, but every combo is vulnerable to removal in some way. In this case, its a Naturalize on the Ascension or a kill/exile on Maralen. The point is to build the deck to make the combo as safe as possible while still remaining aggressive. BrainDamage has an alternative version relying purely on counterspells and some creature destruction, whereby he waits until he has enough mana to do both in one turn, using control to stay alive, and then plays Maralen, backing her up with counters. As I said, I prefer to play aggressively, and activate more quickly. In the end, it comes down to strategy more than deck building. Dropping Maralen does give my opponent an opportunity to kill her next turn, if I don't have the Lightning Greaves and if they actually want to. However, my deck is designed to play both ways. If I know you're running a lot of removal, I'll save Maralen till the Ascension is active - which I can do quite easily without her. Then I play Maralen, and at the beginning of your next turn, you lose. Worst case scenario, I can always find another Maralen - the Ascension is the most important part, as I can win the game through damage, and that is at its most protected simply from the counters I have in the deck. Basically, I believe there is a balance in every deck - somewhere between playing towards my combo, protecting it with spells, protecting myself by killing enemy creatures, and keeping enough power to win if I fail on those three. Having extra cards in my sideboard will allow me to shift that balance as needed ; in the end, it comes down to how you play the cards - do you risk putting Maralen out, or do you save her and cast a Terminate instead. And no, I won't win every game. Do you? :)
... and I chose to go with the option of at least safeguarding the, to me, most important card of the whole combo - Maralen. By adding 4 Lightning Greaves. Even if all my Bloodchief Ascensions get destroyed, I'll at least be able to mill them to their death. As the three of us have said time and time again, throughout the comment sections of the three versions - it's 3 distinctly different versions. All with their own strengths and weaknesses. Which, I think, is a very good thing actually. Not only will it give the three of us a lot of (varying) feedback, it will also allow us to lay the three versions side by side and see what strengths we can adopt from one another. For example, ultimately I did replace even the Vedalken Engineer by now, with an idea I originally got from BrainDamage's version - Wall of Souls. Which, in turn was something I was after by being inspired by your version, FyreFiend - I concluded that one of the key weaknesses of my version was the lack of causes for loss of life. That has been remedied in two ways, the Wall and the Inkfathom Infiltrator. Personally, after all this inspiration and after going through many versions of the deck, I'm at least happy with my version and I hope that the both of you will find your own sweet spot for your versions as well. I still think we should all hold true to our own original idea and not simply start copying each other in every detail. It's better this way, also for the Magic community at large. To see what does work, what doesn't work, all that jazz.
I love your description of the deck accurate and a good summary very well done deck if you could check out my l8est casual deck that would be awesome. http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=168960
I myself went ahead and made a deck with the Maralen/Archive/Bloodchief combo, however, I focused mine more into a tribal of fairies :D Its basically focused on dealing damage through tiny fairies while using all your spells to send your opponents cards to the graveyard to activate bloodchief. Hymn To tourach, pox, smallpox, etc. Can you take a look at it? Hope you like it ^^ http://mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=169497 Its meant to go quick, like here.
And I Put geth's grimoir in a deck with Maralen :P its meant to go if my starting hands are rather focused on the rogues and don't get maralen.