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Aggro-Control style deck. Uses a variety of of creatures backed up with card draw and counters. We'll see how this goes... Comments and suggestions welcome.
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I need one more card to cut. Suggestions?
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I'd think about losing Garruk all together personally, I don't know standard, but I just don't like him personally.
Hmm. Quite honestly, I love Garruk so much. To be fair, most of my experience with him has come from my UG ramp deck and he's beyond amazing in the deck. He plays defense, ramp, aggro, everything. It's an incredible 'Walker against control decks. It's nearly impossible for most control decks to deal with the guy (Cawblade is the exception of course, being good at like everything...). Against aggro, he always can at worst create a blocker to eat a bolt and perform a similar function to Gideon. Again, this experience comes from another deck, but I'd like to try him in this deck at least. The overrun ability seems like it could be a potential game-winner as well. He is a definite consideration for cuts, though. For now, however, I'd like to give him a fair chance in some testing. Thanks for the input, though! =)
You own all these cards?
Yep.:) Well, technically I don't own the 2 Stoneforge Mystics yet, but I have a friend that is going to trade them to me as soon as I see him again (probably this next weekend).
I know you're going to hate me for this, but you don't need garruk. You have birds for ramping, accompanied by lotus cobras, and preordains for mana fixing. you'd be a lot better off running 2 gideons, 0 garruks, and 2 jtms. plus gideon can act as a win con, too. that'd be 60 cards right there, as well. I originally had garruk in my g/w, but he just doesn't do all that much that often. :/ besides that I'd just ditch a mana leak for a 4th cobra. (: but in the side, I found acidic slimes are just too expensive for the curve. in this meta the real threat are swords, and sylvoks work good, as do viridian corrupter. they just help the speed and overall curve of the deck.
Yeah, you could be very right about all of that. I just love Garruk so I'm going to still keep him in until I've done a bit more testing. You could be very right all along, though. The one thing about the Slimes, though, is that they also take out Colonnades, Tar Pits, and Raging Ravines as well which can be critical (not to mention Valakut). Overall, I just feel like it's always done so much for me, so that will come down to testing as well. I could be wrong, and I for sure will be keeping those suggestions in mind. Thank you! :)
Garruk i find is conditional, he's either really good or really bad. :/ sure there are rare in betweens, but mainly i found i'd always rather something else. i.e. vengevine ;P and i still think acidic slimes cost too much for the deck , although good, 5 mana is a lot.. but have you had time to play test yet? : O let me know how it goes for you (:
Ok, so I'll be updating the deck soon after this post, but I took the deck to FNM last night. I've made some pretty big changes to it as well. I didn't actually do terribly well on my first FNM with the deck, but I still feel like it was a terrific choice. I lost 2 matches against decks I don't feel like I should have actually had to lose to. I lost to a friend's UB Tezzeret control deck off a mulligan to 5 and a mulligan to 6 where he was on the play with a double Inquisition of Kozilek hand to crush any chance of breaking out of the mulligan as all I did was topdeck a half dozen lands in an already land heavy hand... The other match I lost with a mulligan to 5 against an elf deck and another match where I kept 2 land and a cobra and couldn't draw another land until he was able to overrun me on turn 4... It also didn't help that I lost EVERY die roll on the night. But anyways, the every game I played I honestly felt favored, as long as I wasn't struggling with land. After the changes I'll soon post, the only other major changes I feel need to be made immediately are changes in the land base. I think I need a 25th land since I have 6 fetch lands in the deck and I need to cut it to 60 cards. Acidic Slime never got a chance to do much on the night. It could have been great in one matchup against an opponent who had Wurmcoils but I had Journey to Nowhere anyways.. Overall the versatility was great against lands and artifacts. Garruk was honestly much much BETTER than expected. He worked exceptionally well with the Squadron Hawks who allowed for a massive Overrun. I won a fair number of games off the back of Garruk more than anything else, usually in combination with Cobras and Birds. It was great. Birds of Paradise were a necessary evil in helping with mana fixing and were almost never a card I didn't want. Overall, I like the maindeck choices. I didn't have much variety and testing to know about the sideboard too much but it could probably use some work. Land base needs work though. Help here would be great. Thanks.:)
Lolsky! You mentioned me! Anyways, I really like this deck and have always thought that Bant is pretty good in the meta. As far as the land base goes, an aggressive deck like this would like to run 4x Rasorforge Thicket, methinks. I mean, the extra two manlands are fine, but you already have 4 collonades. If you find yourself animating stirring wildwood, it's either to desperately chump-block or to try to catch up with a planeswalker. Personally i'd run the thickets. Other than that i feel like the deck is a little bottom heavy. Maybe Sun Titan could show up for a six-drop and bring back 16 of your nonland permanents plus fetchlands. All in all, a pretty sweet deck.
The best part of the Wildwood is actually that they're much better and more mana efficient for a quicker kill with Garruk but I do see your point... I just always hate seeing the Scars lands past turn 3 where at least I can be fine with a manland... I feel like the 6/5 split is fine for now but I'll definitely look into that more. Thanks. Sun Titan seems ok, but at the same time... Does it really help much to bring back any of those cards besides Jace? Idk.. I'm trying a one-of Consecrated Sphinx for now because it just seems pretty good in the meta that is fairly short on instant speed spot removal so it will most often net some form of card advantage and blocks sworded creatures pretty well. I agree that it's a bit bottom heavy though. Thanks for your input.
I really like it. I love the combination of colors, too. Bant is just so synergetic. (: It has a caw-blade feel to it, alongside ramp and garruk's overkill. Nice. (: This deck could definitely profit from batterskull, however. when NPH drops, I'd definitely get a few of those : O Sorry I'm not as intuitive with my advice, lately. Just been not feeling so hot, Magic wise.
Sounds like someone's on tilt. Take it easy man. So you had a bad nationals, so what? You can't run good all the time. Brad Nelson, player of the year 2010 dominated half the season straight. Then, he got to worlds and started off day one at 3-3, ending up overall past 100th place. Point is, we all have our bad days. Sometimes you played worse than usual, sometimes you had a great deck but just not the RIGHT deck for the tournament. The only thing you can do is really just shake it off and move on. Learn from what went wrong - what you lost to, what cards could have helped out, if you really just had the wrong deck for those matchups, etc. You've improved a ton in the past few months. Your next lesson in magic looks like it'll be learning to recover from the occasional setback/failure. I'm sure you'll do just fine and come out of it better than ever though.:) Best of luck with everything.
But can I ask against which matchups you'd side in certain choices? and when you side certain cards in, what cards would you take out? : O
The sideboard is still a work in progress. As for taking out, it really depends on the deck I'm facing. I mean, not every caw-blade deck is the same, especially not at something more local like an FNM so it depends on what I see from the opponent. Basically, I take out what doesn't seem as good as what I put in. Sorry that's all I can give you for that half but it's really hard to say and I'm still trying to figure some of the perfect sideboarding plans myself. Mortarpod is for nearly any fast aggro deck and was a possibility against Cobra decks, though I'm thinking the card all together may just be cut soon. Baneslayer vs. any aggro decks, red decks in particular. Slimes vs. artifact heavy decks, decks with 3 or more colors (and a particularly difficult land base) and decks that plan to attack with manlands. Condemn is for aggro again primarily. Flashfreeze is for Valakut primarily but I also used it against elves when on the play and could work against red decks if on the play just fine as well, especially if you know they run Koth. Spell Pierce is for any control matchup, Caw-variants included. Day of Judgment is for heavy aggro again. After some testing, I may be changing out the Condemns and Mortarpod. I really liked the Journey to Nowhere in the mainboard so may use a couple more of those instead of Condemn but I'm not sure yet.
Ahhh I see. And yeah when I commented I was really just... pissed :P I haven't gotten too much sleep lately, but after I did I felt a lot better. So I put the deck back together and now I'm going down to fnm with the same deck, (well with few changes) and think I'll do great. (:
So, I'm thinking of cutting the Stoneforge package... Probably swap in a couple more Baneslayers, a couple Jace Beleren and possibly even a Spell Pierce or two in the main. I feel like the Stoneforge Mystics were decent in here, but never amazing. More often than not I felt like the most that the sword did was untap my lands so I could then potentially block with one of the manlands. In otherwords, this deck has such explosive mana that it doesn't need the extra untapping. The discard is only slightly relevant and it's not even a true Duress effect letting you choose and see their hand. Any thoughts on this?
...i think stoneforge will be worth it solely for batterskull in NPH
Hmm. Perhaps. Although, EVERYONE will be trying to play that which may be to my advantage, then, to not. And until then... I think I'm going to cut them for now, but I may add Mystic package back and update the deck post-NPH. I just think it's too many one/two-drops with Cobra, Hawks, Birds of Paradise, AND Stoneforge Mystic... I think this deck would maybe rather just go for the turn 3 Baneslayer and adding Beleren enables a turn 2 Jace which majorly halts opposing Caw-Blade decks.
Changes made. Testing will show on this one but I think I like it for now.:) Any more ideas here? Switched up the land base a tad, too. Makes it a bit better overall I think and gives it more reach with the extra Colonnades. The M10/M11 dual lands don't work too effectively in this deck but so I think for this deck I prefer the Scars duals.
did you ever consider maybe venser? not sure how he'd do here, maybe if you added w.o.o, but my friend uses him, and with tumble magnet he's ridiculous : /
I agree with Ethanlewis, I'd suggest venser instead of Journey to Nowhere, if you put him in though I'd suggest putting in Wall of Omens to help you with card advantage as well as potentially Sun Titan. Combine those two with venser makes for some nice advantages. Looks like a good all-round control deck though.
i like the idea of venser in bant, but when i think about it, edna would have to change the deck entirely, so it's probably not the right suggestion for this deck. but venser would work so well with journeys, journey something, then if a bigger threat enters the field, bounce journey and journey the new threat instead. :D sick tech on the go. :P and venser with stoneforge, titan, batterskull, wall of omens, tumble magnet, or even a near death planeswalker would work really well.
Hmm. Interesting idea. I could see Venser being different with a slightly different build, but I think you're right Ethan. I would have to change quite a bit of this deck to make it truly work best. Wall of Omens really isn't much good in this deck, either. I usually want to be able to attack with my creatures and Preordain is just so much better than the Wall for a deck like this and helps me find my threats/answers/sideboard cards quicker and easier when I need to. Unfortunately, as the deck is it really only seems most beneficial with the Journey and maybe a Hawk to shuffle a Jace brainstorm away. I may try Venser out in a cool UW proliferate variation on control that my friend has been trying lately, though. I'll have to check him out again once the new set comes out but probably have a different shell around him.:) Well, it may not be right for this deck but it did basically inspire a whole new one, especially with the new set! Thanks.:)
No problem. (: and p.s. 2 new decks, one's extraction and one's reg green aggro. if you have the time, advice on either one would be great. :D
Ok, so.. I commented on the RG deck and the new mono black decks you made. I did not comment on the extraction deck for a couple reasons. The biggest one is simply because I have never made an extraction deck and have never had to face one either. The other reason is because I personally do not believe they are all they're cracked up to be by some people and just don't think it's a strong enough path to take in standard play especially. It looks like an interesting deck, but I just don't think it's going to win the majority of it's matches. Prove me wrong on this one - it'd be cool to see a new deck do well.:) So, my sideboard still seems lacking. I'm not sure what changes to make though. Any ideas for this part of the deck? Also, I feel like a pair of titans could be great in this deck. Probably a Sun Titan and either 1 Primeval or 1 Frost Titan but I'm not sure which. Any suggestions on stuff to take out?
Explore. Definitely wanna run Explore. I think you are a bit too heavy on duels too. I think J2N should leave, replaced with Tumble Magnet or Condemn maybe. My issue with T2 Bant is you don't really have great spot removal, RUG is better right now IMO. Plus it let's you run 8 Fetches. I would add Wall of Tanglecord to the sb for Caw Blade
Wall of Tanglecord is very weak against Caw-Blade in any testing I've done with almost any deck. Many "pros" are learning to agree. It was neat tech for a bit, but I just don't like it in my experience. J2N is probably my favorite spot removal I can use here actually. It deals with stuff that's not attacking and the cost difference between that and Condemn is so minor in most situations. Tumble Magnet runs out and just isn't my favorite, though I have been considering it. I actually had Explore originally and wouldn't mind having them back. I love it and it does actually allow for the turn 2 JtMS (Birds on turn 1. Cobra, fetch-land, Explore, Fetch-land, Jace on turn 2). I just don't know what to take out. Ramp usually isn't a huge issue for this deck. I only really typically need to hit 4-5 mana and then any more and it's just good for activating Colonnades. What do you suggest over the duals? I've found they're very helpful since the deck has a bit of trouble with mana consistency when I didn't have as many...
Well, I've always prefered off-color decks because Fetches>Duels IMO, though if your keeping in Bant it's hard to argue for too many Basics, so idk.
Yeah, off color is especially nice at times with cards like Lotus Cobra. I have been enjoying the options the bant colors have to offer though, lately. I mean, UW Jace decks are solid normally but I like the addition of green for more speed/power. Garruk is quite the beating with Squad Hawks, too! What about the Explores? Ideas on that? I would like to include them somehow but I'm not really sure what to cut... Also, what do you think about a sprinkling of Titans in here (I'm thinking like 1 Sun Titan and 1 Frost/Primeval perhaps)?
Huh, didn't realize this was yours. Also, quite surprised I haven't commented on this yet. It's quite good, and as expected for Bant, rather versatile. Not liking the double jace package, but perhaps there's a good reason for it. Decks like this one bother me. Don't get me wrong, it's good and I like it. It's just that as an Extractor...a deck that really makes me think about how I would pull it apart bugs me. It means I have to do more to break it...Grrr.
Haha, awesome! The double jace package is two-part and fairly simple. 1st, I only own 2 JtMS but occasionally can borrow 1 or 2 from friends. 2nd, Jace Beleren is excellent on his own and can help stop opposing Jace decks as well. As a hint for breaking it - At this point, Squadron Hawk and Baneslayer are the best routes to victory, though the planeswalkers are more difficult to deal with once down for a typical extraction deck so I'd probably just remove the Gideon and Garruk first, then pull all hawks at once with the new Extraction. Haha.
Bant is so versatile... It pisses me off nice deck though
Haha, thank you I think. ;)
Really really sweet deck, seems so vesitile. I was going to make a suggestion but there's nothing really to say, besides just play test it and see where it goes. If you wouldn't mind I'd really appreciate it if you'd look at my new u/b deck for when nph hits. :) I want to get it as competitive as possible and you seem to give good advice and have good ideas:D
Thanks. I'm planning to continue playtesting, although NPH could shake things up a bit - whether than means this deck will be better or not I guess only time will tell. Sideboard is likely going to need some major changes. I'll check on your deck now though.:)
cool look at my gideon´s parasite