How to: Multiplayer Decks

by BigGeorge76 on 09 October 2014

Main Deck (22 cards)

Sideboard (0 cards)

No sideboard found.

The owner of this deck hasn't added a sideboard, they probably should...

Submit a list of cards below to bulk import them all into your sideboard. Post one card per line using a format like "4x Birds of Paradise" or "1 Blaze", you can even enter just the card name by itself like "Wrath of God" for single cards.


Deck Description

I give FREE LIKES and my best advice to any multiplayer tag. I scroll them daily to see if there are any new ones.

This is a how to guide for some friendly tips on playing free for all multiplayer games! My favorite type of magic. The cards in the deck are ones I mention so you can refer to them.

How to Play

Rule #1: Avoid control target permanent cards. Trust me, just avoid them. Sure stealing your opponents 158/158 trampled-life-linked Ageless Entity is priceless. Then swinging with it and killing him is almost orgasmic. However, we all know “the look” and feeling we get when someone puts their grubby paws all over our hard earned cards. We all know the rage we feel when we hear a giggle and a , “I’ll take that!” Not only that, we all remember 2 years later counting 59 cards in our deck and saying, “I know I had 60 in here. What the hell happened?” Only to thumb through the deck and realize, “Oh shit! I’m missing one of my Pherixan Obliterators!” Memories then flood back at your friend who no longer plays Magic that “stole” it from you. That friend that now has an annoying wife and five kids. A friend that when you ask him where the hell your card is tells you he sold all his cards for a DVD of Frozen and a vacation to Disney World. You remember the moment when his Control Magic took that Obliterator from you, and you instantly want to go all Indiana Jones Temple of Doom on him and hold his beating heart in your hands. You’d ask for the money, but you don’t feel like defending that fact that your 38 and still playing Magic.

Meh :P solid advice: Puschkin (similar advice from Jessie) = I run a few stealers in some of my deck specifically to keep the ridiculous in check. It teaches my buddies to maybe go for less gameturning cards. Which in turn allows myself to play some older, weaker but nicer cards that need some brain to be worthwhile. JESSIE = What if you do play a multiplayer blue deck? In theory, if one of your opponent's throws down a game winning card...you could steal it and therefore, everyone will not lose the game to him. You can almost act as an official...stealing threats that are about to kill an opponent.

Rule #2: Avoid lame combos. Ok so you get pleasure from killing 15 opponents with an infinite damage combo. You cackle manically as you use an unoriginal (or original for that matter) combo on everyone. Its funny to you that your opponents worked so hard to build a creature base, have some awesome equipment rolling, and are popping each other and strategizing for the win, only to have you bring a 45 minute game to an end with an infinite combo—or a Coalition Victory. Guess what? Everyone hates you! They only allow you to keep playing magic with them because you buy pizza and have a cool basement. If you were on fire, no one would pee on you to put you out. You can stop saying, “Everyone attacks me first because I’m so good at magic! Its why I lose so much!” No everyone attacks you first because they hate you.

Bust out this deck when a friend refuse to stop using lame combo decks! http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/antidirtbag-deck/

Rule #3: High casting cost cards that are useless in duels now become top priority. There are countless cards that make you say, “Man 6 mana is just too much in a dueling deck. This card would be perfect if it cost four! Well guess what, in multiplayer game 6 casting cost isn’t a problem, it’s a beast. HOWEVER, Don't forget Early Game!: Yes high casting cost creatures are great, but too many in your deck, and you'll get run over. If you have no early defense up, they will attack you just because they can.

Rule #4: Destruction, Destruction, Destruction: I seriously cannot count the number of times Nevinyrals Disk has won me a game, or at the very least taken a player dominating the board to a player crying in his hands. A timely Wrath of God, and I go from losing, to wining. Moreover, I cannot count the times I looked at my army of creatures and said to myself, “Ugh! If I could just get rid of that fucking Sphere of Saftey! (Or some such other card). I could finish this clown!”

Rule #5: Get THAT card. Everyone has Hexproof, Fear, Unblockable, Shroud, Indestructible, Regenerate, Return From Graveyard. Get those cards that say Exile, remove from game, destroy all, opponent sacrifices, sacrifice all. Sure a destroy all may not work on an indestructible card, but it will work against that pesky privileged position. No multiplayer deck is worth its cost in cards unless you have a way to get rid of your opponent’s solid cards. Simple as that.

Rule #6: Get THOSE CARDS. You want the Hexproof, Fear, Unblockable, Shroud, Indestructible, Regenerate, Return From Graveyard. Not only that, you want versatility, and the ability for cards to keep producing. Cards that make creatures, cards that draw you cards, cards that return things to you, cards that take things away from your opponent multiple times. Disenchant? No thanks. Ray of Distortion? Better. Aura Shards? YES PLEASE!!

Rule #7: Don’t play Armageddon, Winter Orb and their ilk: see Rule #2.

Rule #8: You need to protect against flyers. Trust me, you’ll have the game dominated, only to loose to a lowly Sera Angel because you can’t block flyers. Sometimes a simple Will-O-the-Wisps or Fog Bank can do the trick. You just need something.

Rule#9: Think BIG. 500 life is something that you will see on a night of multiplayer magic. Hell, maybe even 1500 life. Be that guy. Or be able to BEAT THAT GUY. Rouges Passage and Master of Cruelties : D. Or 75 flying 4/4 Angel Tokens. You get the point. Go big or go home. While this may seem like a violation of rule #2, trust me its not. I smile losing with 1754 life because my opponent finally made his 90 2/2 squirrels, and gave them all +x/+x and trample. Sure I say, “Fuck you!” But I really mean, SWEET! Eaten to death by a bunch of HGH Willy Wonka Squirles!! Nice game!

Rule #10: Let that shit go. Nothing ruins a fun night, or a group of magic players quicker than arguing over rules. It gets COMPLEX. Sure in a duel you know that one little trick. You may even have printed the rule out from Magic’s Official web page, or saved it on your phone to show the predictable argument. Not gonna work in a multiplayer game. What do you mean your Squallmonger with lifelink damages my protection from green creature?....NO! It doesn’t matter that it doesn’t target it! Fuck you! Any idiot knows that protection from green means you reduce all damage from a green source to zero regardless if it targets the creature or not! Don’t throw that card at me!! I’ll shove it up your…” …and your circle of Magic friends just got a bit smaller. Argue the point, but if it gets heated, to reference Frozen again, Let it GO!! Remember the rule, and when things are calm, or next time you play, show your friend the rule. He will say, “Shit! You were right! Sorry man!” Or he will still try and argue the rule. If so he is probably the guy from rule #2. Kill him immediately in every game as quickly as possible, and rinse and repeat every game. Your friends will love you.

Rule #11: Don’t look through your deck after losing a 2 hour game and go, “Oh man 2 draws away from wining! Man I would have won if I could have drawn that Wrath of God!” You lost. Your opponent has already blocked out your losers groveling, and is thinking about the next deck he is going to use. It just makes you sound pathetic.

Rule #12: know your enemy. Know what cards your circle of friends like and plan accordingly. They like lame combos and big spells: control spells. They like decks filled with lots of creatures: wraths and disks and such. They like life gain decks: Erebos God of the Dead. You get the point.

Rule#13 Table Talk! Here’s where your skills at negotiation come into play. Bat your eyelashes and push out your chest to expose more cleavage and sheepishly say, ”I p-womise not to attack you with my c-wetuwes for two turns if you don’t deswoy my wittle awtifact.” Ugh that only works for girls. Maybe try. Ok, who wants me to cast Trade Secrets on them? What are you willing to offer? (make sure your holding your drink, because all your friends hands are going to shoot up hurling everything not nailed down to the table all over the room). Choose wisely, and pick your ally accordingly. Pick cards that make friends. Finally, always keep your word when you make promises…even if it will cost you the game. You’ll get the reputation of a man who keeps his word and can be trusted. It will make your table talk more potent and in-turn allow you to manipulate the players better to your advantage. Here's a copied deck I found looking at an old web site that I think is pretty awesome at excelling at this fact. It's fun and never dull:

http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/politics/

Rule #14: Feed your engine: Don't go crazy with ideas. This is one that translates to any deck, multiplayer or not. Pick what you want your deck to do: AKA How you want to win. And support that with your deck. Remember, pick an ENGINE. Say its nevinrayls disk. The DISK IS YOUR ENGINE. Feed it with fuel. Fuel in the form of creatures who regenerate, indestructible creatures, awesome lands it wont affect (or turn into creatures) cards that bring stuff back. Rule 14 and 4 go together for sure. Feed the Engine and destroy their stuff. Remember each slot needs to fill some role. No spot should be wasted in your 60 cards. They all must serve the following three purposes: destroy their shit, make your engine better, and win you the game.

Deck Tags

  • Not an actual deck
  • How to
  • Multiplayer

Deck at a Glance

Social Stats

55
Likes

This deck has been viewed 7,545 times.

Mana Curve

Mana Symbol Occurrence

126928

Card Legality

  • Not Legal in Standard
  • Not Legal in Modern
  • Not Legal in Vintage
  • Not Legal in Legacy

Deck discussion for How to: Multiplayer Decks

"...he sold all his cards for a DVD of Frozen and a vacation to Disney World."
Mwahahahaha

1
Posted 09 October 2014 at 02:09

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I would have done the (almost) same thing just to BE PURE EVIL MUHAHAHAHAHAHHA!!!!!!!

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 12:46

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frozen is about two girls finding love, with each other. Nothing evil about that. But disney world is another story, those lines.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:13

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Still haven't been there. .. XD

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 05:47

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no imeant selling the cards

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 10:00

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Groovy :-) Got quite some good points there, many of them I learned the hard way :p I'm now in the position where, whichever deck I play, I always hear "Ah man, not thàt deck! We're all dead... Scoop!!!" when I play my first card. And then they all target me :p So I'm trying to turn that around, but it's not easy.

Would not have made that mistake if this page was made earlier :p

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Posted 09 October 2014 at 07:59

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This deck may help you go a long way to accomplishing the goal. http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/politics/

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 03:37

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i feel your pain spiffmeister. i have a few decks that my friends will not play against if they realize what it is. kinda lame since they are fun to play, and not overly powerful, just annoying to beat

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 12:43

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Enjoyable post. I agree with most of it and only play casual (mostly multiplayer) with friends. However a Winter Orb/Stasis or Wrath of God is needed once in a while just to f*** with people.

1
Posted 09 October 2014 at 20:51

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LOL ya no doubt!

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 01:16

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I agree. You usually see one per big game of multiplayer anyways. Winter Orb/Statis is rare but you see it every once in a while.

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Posted 17 October 2014 at 19:40

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I am iffy on some of your rules too.

#1 for example.
What if you do play a multiplayer blue deck? In theory, if one of your opponent's throws down a game winning card...you could steal it and therefore, everyone will not lose the game to him. You can almost act as an official...stealing threats that are about to kill an opponent.
If opponent A is being destroyed by opponent's B creature...you tell opponent B, "Hey bro, I will steal his creature and not attack you anymore, as long as you don't hurt/target me for a few turns in return."
Or, let us say opponent B can not be targeted by opponent C...you tell opponent C, "Hey bro, I will steal his permanent so that you can attack him, as long as you don't hurt/target me for a few turns in return."

I LOVE #3
Usually, if you are playing a card over 5 mana, in one-on-one matches, you have done something wrong. Almost always the mana cost are 5 or less. Multiplayer finally gives you the chance to play those crazy 8 mana spells! Hello Insurrection!!! Why yes I will play this 8 mana spell to steal every creature in the game (The Hell with Rule #1! lol) and attack you with them.

#10 rocks too!
Lol at the Frozen/let it go sentences! I like your writing, good sir.

Finally, can I suggest you add #13?
I am awful at multiplayer deck building...and have only had once chance, in the last year, to play any multiplayer games...however, what about this:

Rule # 13. Play cards that your opponent might consider keeping you around if played.

Example. Howling Mine. It is a fun card. It is global. For everyone. Speeds up the game. Gives everyone extra mana. Adds an extra layer to the game. If you play that, your opponent might say, "Why would I want to kill him, if I am going to not be able to draw that extra card every turn? Maybe I will not target him."
Example #2. Mana Flare. Another fun card. Extra mana for everyone! You sir, are Mr. Nice Guy! Why would I want to kill you if you are giving me free stuff?

Will you consider looking at this multiplayer deck?
Any help would be a great help...just in case I do ever get to play multiplayer again.

http://www.mtgvault.com/jessie/decks/really-fun-multiplayer-deck/

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Posted 09 October 2014 at 21:42

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Thanks. Sure I'll check your deck out. I have a few cards in mind for rule #13 as well, I actually made a deck based on this concept. I think rule one is more of a personal pet peeve of mine, I HATE people stealing my stuff! Haha! Your advice on the way to play those stealing cards is solid though.

2
Posted 10 October 2014 at 01:19

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Yeah, grubby little hands touching your expensive cards, I get it! :)

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 01:20

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To add to your #13 suggestion, It works. Particularly with the new Parley cards from Conspiracy Selvala, Explorer Returned and Edric, Spymaster of Trest. Nobody ever wants to hit you since they love what your doing for them. Until they realize they have let it go to far and you Win. :)

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Posted 11 October 2014 at 14:39

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For sure, I am going to put together a budget parley deck, in the next few weeks

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 15:16

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Imo, if you can pull off a Coalition Victory, you deserve to win the game. Anyways, I found this rather helpful.

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Posted 09 October 2014 at 21:46

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No doubt hard to pull off, but in the right deck not as hard as you may think. And thats exactly what my friend that uses that card says when we all yell at him! LOL Solid point though.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 01:21

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when someone at our games win like that we let him sit out and finish the game with one less person so he gets the point dont bring that shit to our table lol

1
Posted 10 October 2014 at 13:12

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Haha! Love it!!

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 17:24

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I pulled a Mortal combat win last night !! And my buddy said that was almost cheap as eldrazi win for fun of course, 4 player game

1
Posted 12 October 2014 at 17:39

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I like group hug cards in multiplayer! People tend to not go after the guy helping them out. Cards like:

Heartbeat of Spring
Howling Mine
Braids, Conjurer Adept
Kami of Crescent Moon
Rites of Flourishing
Favor of the Mighty

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Posted 09 October 2014 at 21:54

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See my Rule # 13.

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Posted 09 October 2014 at 21:58

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This deck screams rule 13: http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/politics/

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 03:37

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Jace Beleren +2 ability and everyone usually leaves you alone if you use the -1 every once in a while. If he gets too high people will think they are going to get targeted for mil

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Posted 17 October 2014 at 19:44

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Does squallmonger actually do that? Seriously, because I . . . If it does I have some apologies to make, not for that card specifically but for something else. But The rules interation there confuses me. because i thought protection did prevent the damage, thus no lifegain.

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Posted 09 October 2014 at 22:14

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You are correct, the squallmonger doesn't do any damage to a creature that has protection from green. The argument was because someone thought that IT DID.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 01:23

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I mostly play multi player and it doesn't matter if im playing normal or edh im always the bad guy in my group lol. I have more exp and a better card collection then anyone I play against. and I do hate it when they steal my commander but I steal there commanders once in awhile to. I think the key to multiplayer is a good poker face and the abilty to talk the table into going after someone else lol

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 04:33

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Yup, that's it indeed! I love showing people who the bigger threat is, while I'm hoarding several dozens of life and a board domination :p

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 07:22

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I seriously need to rebuild my infect deck...

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 05:55

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I must say, one friend of mine came to mind while reading this. He makes the most dirtbag decks that are no fun to play vs. He always argues rules (even when i've showed him 1000x that he's wrong)... yes he makes decks based around breaking rules 2 and 7...

what do you think of Lethal Vapors + Enchantment return + Indestructible? :P

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 04:46

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See rule 2!! Haha! I'm going to make an "Anti-Dirt Bag Multiplayer Deck!" Will be my next project.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 12:35

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Not the greatest deck, but as promised an ANti-Dirtbag Deck!! http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/antidirtbag-deck/

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 22:22

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That was AMAZING. Loved it. You've certainly played a lot of multiplayer, like me. When I checked these out, I several times thought: "Yeah, I can agree with that... That's true... Heck, this is how it is! This guy knows exactly what he is talking about!"
I really enjoyed this. It reminded of my How to: Build MTG deck that I did about ten months ago.

1
Posted 10 October 2014 at 06:25

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Thanks Northern! That deck of yours is what actually inspired me to write this article.

3
Posted 10 October 2014 at 12:19

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Nice to hear I inspired you on something this cool!
Keep going man! Keep going!

1
Posted 10 October 2014 at 12:53

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next on mtgvault, budget multiplayer decks

1
Posted 10 October 2014 at 06:28

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Definitely.

1
Posted 10 October 2014 at 06:33

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ohdeargoditshappening

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 06:43

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Yes, I already built one as well! http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/you-sure-about-that-budget/

2
Posted 10 October 2014 at 12:21

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ok so rule 14 is the thing that I find really hard. I often try and draw aggro to me by saying thins like "who here votes for a wrath" if someone is going to get knocked out from the game. But also I tend to back backstabbed by people I from an alliances with... any tips to prevent that?

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 09:48

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Yes, don't trust anyone :p

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 09:55

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Yes, you have been tabbed the weak one. They know they can promise you things and then betray you. Someone did that to me, I would spend the next 2, maybe 10 games playing my tournament legacy elf deck and doing nothing but attacking them to kill them. What you say? That means we would both be dead and have to watch Football while everyone else played? Damn right! I would teach them a lesson, AND ANNOUNCE TO ALL I WAS AND WHY. If everyone betrays everyone all the time, its your chance to establish some honor to your game...AGAIN ANNOUNCE THAT, hammer it home to them. You may lose some games at first, or for a few weeks, but eventually you'll start being a real force.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 12:26

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as one of those backstabbing assholes, first rule only trust them so long as they have nothing to gain from not attacking you. Also, very important rule here, Alliances only work until it gets down to three people unless your alliance is based on mutual hatred of a dick who is doing something that breaks the infinite combo rule. In magic vengeance is far sweeter than friendship. BigGeorge sort of demonstrates the sweet sweet taste of vengeance. Do you have a good board position, and you finish off player four and pass turn? Don't be suprised at all by your "allies" planar cleansing ruining you and handing the game to either himself or player three. Now if you weasel a promise of no attacks with each other out of them until its just the two of you, then they are probably lying to you. Again unless there is some vengeance there to glue the alliance together. Basically the only constant is that winning is a sweet prize, and revenge is sweeter. Make alliances based on that, recognize when they are going to fall apart do to pressure from winning, and you will do fine.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 14:04

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. . . you know what I think ill stick to 1vs1...

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 15:38

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No, just stop playing free-for-all games. Those are stupid for so many reasons. Stick to formats where everyone has a clear win condition other than "last man standing": Two-Headed Giant, Emperor, French Emperor or the king of multiplayer formats: Pentagram.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 15:48

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Those each require a set number of people. What if we want a 7 player game? or a 19 player one? Also all those literally take the funnest game of the game out of the game, Politics. I have had 8 person games that played out like fucking game of thrones and were memorable as shit. The reason for this, is because politics is a great second layer to a game that requires strategy in and of itself, adding so much depth you could drown people in it.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:09

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Definitely some more options available instead of free-for-all ;) good point Puschkin

1
Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:30

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3 players: Free-for-all. It's the only setup where FFA makes sense.
4 players: 2HG or regular team games.
5 players: Pentagram or French Emperor*
6 players: Emperor
7+ players: Grand Melee

Politics are still involved in Pentagram, that's why I called it the king of multiplayer formats*. Also, obviously, Necrumlsice doesn't enjoy politics.

Besides, what you call politics oftentimes just means "ganging up on player X". If you are lucky, because then, at least, games are over quickly. But if everybody knows what he is doing, it'll take 30 minutes until you can take your next turn and in the end, it doesn't matter at all what kind of deck you play. In fact, in those "political" games, the winner is usuall the worst deck. Or the winner is decided at random after hours of exhausting debates, when everybody ran out of cards and options, whoever topdecks the right card wins. Especially in EDH. I can fully understand why people don't like that and my advice to play thementioned formats is therefore suitable for everybody that has problems with this.

*French Emperor also involves Politics and bluffing assuming you play a variant where the emperor knows who the traitor is

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:34

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what the hell is grand melee? Never even heard of that one.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:38

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Grand Melee:

Nobody play that anymore because people stopped playing at conventions :P
In Grand Melee you can have any number of players. You sit in a circle. You can only attack to the left. Global spells and effects like Wrath of God aren't global, they affect yourself, the 2 players left of you and the 2 players right of you. If you have a targetted effect or spell you can target yourself/permanent of yours or one to the left or right normally and you can target 2 seats away if you pay two life.
For every complete set of 5 players there will be 1 player taking turns simulatenously (pass around a box or something), to speed up things. It gets problematic when players are liminated because at some point, you have to remove a box and one player will get robbed off a turn (at no point two players that are in the area of influence of each other should take turns at the same time). The player losing the turn untaps his stuff and draws a card.

Winner is last man standing. However, this was usually played at conventions, players payed a small participation fee and you were granted a booster pack for each kill you made. So, theoretically, you could make more boosters than the actual winner if you killed enough players. This should prevent 20+ players all playing completely defensive decks.

Good old times :)

Probably unplayable with modern cards and combos, though.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:47

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that is interesting actually. But yeah in modern that would just be all weird to play. Besides the fact that the game lasts 4 hours just leads to more rising tension, as the stakes are raised and nobody wants to leave their massive time investment. Also what about things like karn's ultimate. That is something a bit more than just a global effect. There are probably other things i just can't think of any.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 19:03

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Emblems also work with a range of two. Anyway, I wouldn't participate in any kind of multiplayer with more than 6 players anyway because the turns take so damn long. Back then it was quite easy because players had Mahamoti Djinns and Shivan Dragons (all with the same art), now if the 4 other players in your range have a combined 50 non-land permanents out you will most likely have to read half of them and none of them would be as easy to remember as Juggernauts or Hypnotic Specters.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 19:47

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i remember my first 19 player game. took 7 hours. would have taken longer but 2 hours in it was only 4th round so 3 people quit, but not before one of them armageddoned like a douche. Actually those people probably quit because of Armageddon now that i think about it. Also Karns ability is the game you are playing ends, then start a new game with all things exiled by karn under your control. Not an emblem.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 20:44

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Yeah, okay, there are a few banned cards of course (Sharazad is similar) but in Karns case I see no problem to just apply it to you and the 2 poor people left and right to you.

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 12:47

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a mode of play we love in my group is with 5+ players and we call it Around the world. you can only target the player directly left or right of you and global effect only affect them. it adds strategy cause you might have an easy target to your right but the guy right next to him is too menacing for you so you leave him and target the othr guy.

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Posted 26 October 2014 at 13:53

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Rule #1: Avoid control target permanent cards.
I have to disagree on this one. It's becoming annoying if too many players do that, however, these days there are way too many ridiculous cards out there, especially among creatures. While stealing something might ruin the rare hour of glory when a creative deck got "off", most of the time you steal something something very lame like a tinkered third turn Darksteel Colossus or an out of control Forgotten Ancient or Vulturous Zombie. You have to admit that it doesn't need creative decknbuilding skills to get those. I run a few stealers in some of my deck specifically to keep the ridiculous in check. It teaches my buddies to maybe go for less gameturning cards. Which in turn allows myself to play some older, weaker but nicer cards that need some brain to be worthwhile.

Rule #2: Avoid lame combos.
Fully agree

Rule #3 (High casting costs)
Erm, sure, but that's how beginner's decks are build anyway ;)
However, the game has gotten very fast, even in multiplayer. While you have more time and can affotd to run some high casting cost stuff, you can't be too slow either! Even midrange decks can get overrun easily without breaking a sweat. See, these days it is super easy to drop just three or so creatures that beef each other up just because they share a creature type or block mechanic. Often times I can't even afford to play a Darksteel Ingot turn 3 because I desperately need a blocker ... turn 3! In Multiplayer!

Rule #4: (Mass) Destruction
While this is important, games aren't exactly interesting if every player packs literally more destruction than permanents!
Since you won't be able to remedy that and players will never retire their goddamned Wraths (pun intended) I began adjusting my decks and started packing more cards, especially creatures, that have CIP or LP effects or that can be used in respones to destruction. That way, they have already payed for themselves, even when destroyed.

Rule #5: (Exilers and so on)
This is actually a vicious cirlce and linked to #4: Players pack too much (mass) removal, so players responded and switch to indestructible stuff, hexproof and so on. The response to that is Swords to Plowshares, Gravepacts and other nasty stuff. Again, this is a logical progression, but not exactly good for play! I don't want to play unnerbving cards like Balance in multiplayer but the mindset of both #4 and #5 are forcing me to do just that!

Rule #6: Get THOSE cards:
See 4 & 5. I say, using cards like Invisible Stalker and then piling pumping spells on it is in no way better than #2. Don't be THAT guy!!!

I try to escape that vicious circle of #4-6, both for the sake of my playgroup's health and for my own sanity. It's not easy but it can be done. There are several solutions, I already named one in #4, but there are more. Here are two of my decks that was specifically designed to counteract #4 and #5:
http://www.mtgvault.com/puschkin/decks/pump-up-the-wham/
http://www.mtgvault.com/puschkin/decks/trample-brontale/

Rule #7: Don’t play Armageddon, Winter Orb and their ilk
Mostly agree, don't fully cut players off their mana, that doesn't generate interesting games. However, due to #3 and the general high powerlevel of modern high casting cost stuff, I'd say it should be allowed to play something like Keldon Firebombers, just to keep everyone in check. It should be possible to play midrange decks with mana curves that end at 5-6 mana.

Rule #8: You need to protect against flyers.
This is a minor rule and can be covered with enough removal and other tricks. After all, you have to be prepared for flyers no less than for shadows, unblockables, landwalkers and similar stuff that might be less frequent in cards but equally frequent in actual play thanks to #6. And you can't prepare for EVERYTHING.

Rule#9: Think BIG.
Yes and know, as I just said, you can't be prepared for everything. I would revise this rule and be more specific:
Focus less on set values ("deal 3 damage to target player or creature") and instead look for variables in cards ("deal 1 damage for each creatrue in play"). Because in multiplayer, those numbers will be bigger. Of course this might lead to the flatout stupid cards like the Forgotten Ancient I mentioned earlier, but that's how you should think when building multiplayer decks.

Rule #10: Let it go!
While I generally agree with that sentiment, rules are rules and if you constantly let it go, people will never learn anything. My suggestion: Keep a website with rulings open at all times, most questions can be answered right away by just reading the erratas and card rulings of the cards involved. And for the cases that doesn't work, determin a judge for that evening. He decides and everybody else accepts his decision, no matter what. If he makes biased decisions constantly, chose someone else next time. And whoever thinks he got screwerd is invited to make further investigations THE NEXT DAY!
And I want to extend the "let it go" mentality to something else: If someone betrayed you ingame or killed you for nothing or made idiotic decisions that affect you negatively and so on ... keep your revenge fantasies to the current game! Don't hold a grudge for the rest of the evening!
Many times it went like this: Player A plays a hated deck and pisses off Player B. Next game Player B plays his Legacy tournament deck just to stick it back to Player A. NEXT game, Players C and D bust out their combo decks because they had no fun those first 2 games ... this can go on until you realized that it is 4 in the morning and nobody had fun so far, which is idiotic! So: Calm down, don't hold on grudges and if you absolutely have to play a stinker deck, announce that in advance. It is much better for everyone involved (and can even be fun!) if everybody plays their degenerate decks at the same time!

Rule #11: Looking at top cards after losing
Aw, come on! You'd have to be a shaolin monk to be able to resist looking at it! Yes, don't make a big story out of it, especially don't do the "if I only drew X, you would all be dead by now" nonsense, but if the very next card is what you were waiting for, it can be interesting to know for everyone.
BTW, the true reason to not do it (or to look but without telling enybody) would be that you don't want let your opponents know what your deck is capable of. Shutting up increases the chances to win with that deck for the next games.

Rule #12: Metagaming
Of course that's important, however, that's not specific for multiplayer! In fact I might be inclined to say that it is a lot less important than in 1-on-1 (where sideboards are allowed). Also, I don't play multiplayer/casual to win, I play for the heck of it, and if I want to play that Marble Priest deck, no amount of wall-hate will stop me :)

Rule # 13: Table Talk
Of course. I could write an entire book about it. And that's not an exaggeration.

Rule # 14: Fuel your engine
Yes, you have to be a both a very experienced deckbuilder and multiplayer before you whould considering subthemes or combos that are spread across 4+ cards.
HOWEVER, I noticed a trend recently where deckbuilders tend to overstuff their decks with their "engine" (or basic idea), totally neglecting other parts of deckbuilding like lifegain, carddraw, recursion, removal etc. At the very least you should check if those basic effects are available within your theme (so if your theme is soldiers and first strike, try to find a first striking soldier with lifelink so that you cover life gain etc.) and if you can't find anything, you should seriously consider adding something out-of theme. Nobody will dismiss you or your deck if you run a wizard in your soldier deck because you wanted carddraw. In fact it's modern plague that players think your deck is garbage if it doesn't 100% match creature type X or block mechanic Y.


BigGeorge, thank you for giving me an opportunity to release this wall of text :)
You might be interested to check out my decks or at least the challenge I put up recently
http://www.mtgvault.com/puschkin/decks/obscure-card-challenge-occ/
Because I think we think very much alike and would be compatible to each other's playgroups :)

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 14:46

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so much commenting I need to do on this thread.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:27

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Awesome response for sure Puschkin! I'm going to add and reword a couple rules. Thanks so much for the input! I'll definitely check out your challenge and decks.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:32

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Oh and I agree for sure on your Rule #8 comment, but a flyer is something your going to see in most EVERY game. So that puny little 2/2 flyer is going to go to the person who doesn't have any. And if two or three players do, your nights ending quickly. Where as a shadow/unblockable/landwalker is a threat to all, and most likely going to vanish rather quickly.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 16:54

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How to win multiplayer games:
1. Prophet of Kruphix/Veilstone Amulet/Simic Charm. Keep that guy alive and cards in hand. Don't forget a counterspell for that Wrath of God around the corner.
2. Grave Pact: you're now the token for creature removal. no pun intended.
3. Chandra Spitfire + Guttersnipe. 1 Lightning Bolt later... and you might rub it in: don't fry, don't fry. It's just a game!

Don't have anything for you in white, but it probably has something to do with 1,500 life.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 17:29

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White has fun stuff like Congregate. :)

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 17:39

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There should be a rule in magic if a player exceeds douchebagery in lifegain, he loses the game.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 17:44

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Just use Magus of the Mirror on him.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 19:07

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or the artifact from new phrexia. That does the same thing.

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Posted 10 October 2014 at 19:09

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Most of my decks handle multiplayer quite well. I used to used to run a Prophet of Kruphix with Glen Elendra Archmage I think it was, eternal witness, and a counterspell. I ended up x'ing the archmage because recurrable counterspell every turn just wasn't fair. I found I enjoy Simic Charm much much more. Still have that GraveCraft deck (grave pact and earthcraft). Too much indestructible and such going on to not do so. Besides, Natural Affinity is funny after a Wrath of God with Grave Pact out.

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Posted 11 October 2014 at 01:53

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The only time I steal something is in Commander, and even then it's only when someone plays something that's a bigger F.U than stealing. We had one guy in a 4-player laughing his ass off after getting his "It that Betrays" Eldrazi into play (an Eldrazi that steals stuff, how fun, not to mention his commander was Miku of the Twin Reflections and next turn he was set to copy it 4 times), next turn I stole it with Hypnotic Siren, cloned it with Fated infatuation AND slapped Alpha Authority (Hexproof, can't be blocked by less than 2 creatures) on the copy, his face was priceless.

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Posted 11 October 2014 at 13:18

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Lol, Rule#13.

This woman I knew, who sold MtG cards at a shop in town, asked me if I could teach her to play. We set up a time and place and got started from there. She told me to go easy on her, and let her win. Ok, I let her win. Only because I didn't want to discourage her from playing the game and also, because she was a girl. When she got pretty good with her deck (playing a goblin deck I made. Be sure to check my profile to see it!), I started winning a game here and there, you know, to not be a total sucker. Suddenly, she started to replace the word 'deck' with 'dick'. So she would say things like,

"Let me tap your dick."
"Going to shuffle your dick."
"Please let me win, don't beat me with you dick."

And not too long after that she would go on talking really nasty, no filter, whatsoever. I lol'd and asked her not to say those things so loud in the cafe where we played. But she made me laugh, so I ended up "misplaying" and she won savoring every second of it with the goblin token deck (Be sure to check my profile to see it!).

As it turns out she was just extremely horny, and was a born-again virgin, as she put it across the table one afternoon. Well, I guess I could just let her win most of the evening and hope to get laid. Nah, she was just a tease, but I would soon start to play her game. When we played at her shop I talked all nasty and stuff. She started to get red-faced and she couldn't focus. I lol'd and played with some fierce competitiveness as she got flushed and started fanning her face with her hand. She confessed one afternoon to me that she had to masturbate during work and she had to cross her legs a lot because of how wet she got when I teased her.

Well, it just lead up to a summer fling and shit. Oh, but be sure to check out my profile and check out my goblin token deck!

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Posted 11 October 2014 at 15:30

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damn that story is hot, but it also has nothing to do with multiplayer.

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 00:56

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lmao.
I almost fail out of my seat, reading your response Necromaster, lol.

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 00:58

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Dat deck advertising though...

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 17:12

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Yeah, that's not multiplayer, it's 1-on-1 ;)

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 17:45

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Heartlesszio has deleted this comment.

Posted 11 October 2014 at 15:31

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This post is freaking awesome, I only play multiplayer really and on occassion 1v1 (or tbh when its myself and another player left in a multiplayer match). I cant agree more with rule 1 and 2, I avoid lame combos and enjoy the thrill of building an army of pure death (green trample decks ftw especially with Overwhleming Stampede). Because of this my opponents run creature control cards alot...sooooooo frustrating. Oh hey I just made an Ageless Entity with 398 p/t annnnnndddd its gone.

I've read the comments above on multiplayer formats. Free for All is fun but does go down the road "ohhhh, not that deck...scoop" or "I hate that deck everyone target him/her." However there is a fun format called Predator and Prey (no one mentioned it so figured I'd put it out there). Best played with 4 to 5 players as to not congest play, everyone attacks to their left and defends to their right. Global cards effect everyone (unlike Grand Melee). Last player standing wins.

Also Planeschase format is freaking awesome too (no one mentioned it either). The cards are a bit expensive here and there but the rule changes make for interesting play. Basically normal multiplayer game but you have a set of planes cards and you start the game in a particular plane which has certain rules that affect the gameplay. Each turn you can role a die, which has a chaos marker (activate current planes special ability) or planes marker (move to the next plane), where each role past your first costs 1 mana then 2, 3 so on so forth. Check it out its exceptionally fun and great post, loved it. The more I read the more I agreed.

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 00:17

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Thanks! Awesome thanks for even another way to play multiplayer!

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 21:58

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This reminds me of everything that's wrong with multiplayer MTG. Everyone ends up getting butthurt and any sore loser can claim he only lost because the winner's deck cost more to build than his. Rule #2. BS. Gamebreaking cards are a big NO-NO, but then, mass removal is cool, no infinite combo, but having 1k+ life is cool... WTF. Really? This comes from a player who has about 20 competitive Vintage decks and countless modern decks. I have a reputation, and a collection worth near $10k, collected over a few decades. People attack me first in MP games not because they hate me, but because they fear me, because they know they can't beat me 1v1, so they assume my decks will work as good in MP, which is NOT the case. And it's so annoying. A 4 player game always ends up being 3v1, never 1v1v1v1. And if I dare mention the fact that killing my 1/1 fodder token is dumb when there's a Simic Manipulator on the board, I get called out by a retard who thinks I'm running an imbalanced deck when I'm playing a standard deck worth $20 and he's running a vintage mono black deck with 4x Demonic Tutor, along with quad Norrits and Royal Asses, but still manages to lose every game he plays against my creature based decks, because I know how to sideboard, and he just plays every card he has, as soon as he can, every single game, despite losing to the same card 10x in a row (and trust me, I tried to teach him...). And according to rule 10, I should let it go and not argue about rules, only that other guy thinks activated abilities are the same as spells being cast, so he's trying to counter my Llanowar Elf tapping for mana... Do I help him become a better player by developing a better understanding of the game? Of course not, if I do, I'm the bad guy, breaking everyone's balls with my pedantic crap... Don't get me wrong, with time, I've found good friends I could play MTG with, without it always ending badly, but fuck those rules, there's only one rule and it's that everyone should be having fun. If my fun is to be fucking pedantic about rules, then why the fuck should I ignore someone's ignorance for the sake of letting him have fun while I'm pulling my hair off my head? No way, Jose. I'd rather play alone than play it wrong, and I found people who thought alike. Some of my best friends play MTG, but I don't play with them, because they don't even understand what 'format' means, and the 'alpha male' in the group is a stubborn fuck who'd rather play it wrong than concede that I might know more about the game than he does. Bottom line is that everyone knows what being a jerk means, just don't do it. If I'm going to test a deck with a crazy combo or whatever, I let people know what I'm up to, if they'd rather play tribal/creature, then they just have to say so and I'll play another deck. Obviously, most of my rant should be taken with a grain of salt, but, to this day, there are people who refuse to play with/against me, and I never really understood why. Sure, I can be pedantic and annoying, but if that's how I'm having fun, how is it any worse than that guy who's having fun despite not playing priority right and not understanding how the stack works? Is MP MTG supposed to be a "no child left behind" kind of game, so dumbed down that it gets boring to the point where people who really love the game for what it is (was?) don't even want to play it anymore?

Sorry about the wall of text, but this seemed like the right place to vent...

tl;dr: This game was meant for duels.

In any case, if you're going to play MP, make sure you play with people who are on the same level as you, otherwise, it always ends up being painful.

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 00:49

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I have 5 counterspells in a 60 card deck. Count em 5. God forbid a simic deck has counterspell in it. I've met people that blocked me because I countered a spell!? It's one thing if a someone counters the first 3 cards you play. It's another story when you have 5 in a deck and the best blue/green has to offer in creature control is a bounce. I mean really?

On another note any card with mox or lotus in it, that isn't green, is a bullshit card that minimizes one of green's strengths.

Also, the fact that Twincast doesn't copy Storm abilities on a card is bologna.

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 09:46

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I understand what one persons "lame" might be fine for another. I hear what your saying, 1000 life may seem = in your eyes, or no different than a triskellion infinite combo. It's a solid point, just one I don't agree with. In my opinion, violations of rule#2 ruins the fun for me. Again, just my opinion, but one most friends I play with agree on.

As to deck cost, I think many on this site prove that--outside of legacy & modern tournament decks--card cost doesn't mean squat. There are lots of cheap decks that are plenty solid to play casual.

Its hard to make sense of your third point but it seems like you have conflict with your friends? It seems your decks are better than theirs, and/or are much newer to magic than you, or a combo of both? Perhaps your simply on a higher level than they are? I'm not sure, but maybe you could play some budget decks against them, or tone down your decks when you play. Magic should be fun, but I'm sure its not fun for your friends if all your decks whip them every time. Either that or maybe its time to find some new friends, or take a look at yourself and your behavior.

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 22:09

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First of all, thanks for reading my wall of text and for your reply. (Here's your 2nd test...!)

For the first point, I think we'll agree that as long as everyone around the table agree to 'some' 'rules', everyone can have fun. Problem here is that with some people, as soon as I talk about format or budget or rules, I automatically become 'that guy'. I get that they're 'casual' and that they don't care about rules, but considering the next points, it's simply absurd. There are rules to every game, for a reason.

As far as deck cost is concerned, you're perfectly right that anyone can build a very decent deck on a budget, Northern proves it every time he posts a deck from his 'budget' series. Kudos to him and everyone else who contribute to this site. But that's what I was getting at. I have a few decks that are 'Vintage Competitive', decks that are worth well over 100$. Decks that aren't anymore fun to play against than they are for me to play. I'm thinking Food Chain Goblin or Tribal Elf, 2 decks that can see my entire library on the board on turn 3. I love those decks, but they're just trophies and I never play them, unless I'm asked to. Problem is, a particular person (the one I referred to as the 'alpha male' of that group), who is the organizer of the games for his circle of friends, and among my best friends IRL (unless MTG is concerned, really, then we're like fire & ice...), and he literally makes it a point to warn everyone about how good I am and how expensive my decks are. Thing is, he's thinking about the aforementioned decks, which I didn't even bring, a fact I make sure to mention and repeat. Still, as was mentioned earlier, he'll Demonic Tutor on T2, to fetch a Terror so he can kill a 1/1 Squirrel token of mine on T3, while he lets other players build up their forces. Then, as I'm open, everyone burns me, and I get to be a spectator. Now, this is sound strategy, weaken the strongest opponent so everyone can gang up on him, but remember I'm not playing an overpowered deck, he's just so butthurt he can't beat me 1v1 (even when he plays any of MY decks and I play any of HIS...) that he influences his pals to rape me, and if I say anything about it (you know, after the 4th time around, after 3 hours of watching them), I become 'that guy' again.

The third point was pretty much resumed above. I don't have a problem with them (I rarely have a problem with anyone) as much as 'they' seem to have a problem with me. My decks aren't better than theirs, as much as I happen to understand the meta game better than 'they' do (it's all about one guy, really, the others are just messing with me because he tells them too, afaik, although when voices get louder, everyone gets involved, and in the long run, they decided I was 'that guy', which I have no problem living with, as I have other friends who are on my level I play with and have tons of fun with). Heck, I know every card in my buddy's 'main' deck... Demonic Tutor, Royal Assassin, Norrit, Nightmare, Sengir Vampire, Terror, Dark Ritual, Dark Banishing, Will'o'the'Wisp, 4 of each, with lands (and I'm pretty sure he had an XB direct damage spell, but it wasn't Consume Spirit, drawing a blank atm...). With that deck, you have a chance at beating pretty much anyone and you're sure to have very decent control over the board of any game, duel or MP. I don't say a word about his banned Demonic Tutors, yet, if and when I beat him in a duel, he thinks it's because my 20$ budget deck I'm playing for the first time to test out is OP (when it's really because I know what he's playing and 'sideboard' accordingly), so when we play MP, he figures the deck I just beat him with will hold its ground in a 4 or 5 man FFA... Heck, he even plays a 'vintage' affinity deck with tinkers and artifact lands..., if anything, I should be the one invoking rule 2, but no, I'm 'that guy', because his buddies always side with him. >.<

Either way, we all have plenty of decks, so as far as deck quality/worth is concerned, it varies between games, but the last few times I played there, I was playing standard budget decks I had just built and wanted to test out, while everyone else was playing casual (no format, no rules, except not more than 4x of any unique card...). For that matter, I built most of their decks... And if I didn't build it, I probably was asked to check it out to see if I could think of something to make it better, which obviously also let's me figure how each of their deck can be beaten, but that's pretty irrelevant since none of my card can stick to the board for more than 1 turn, anyway.

As far as experience is concerned, I'm pretty much the newest guy, I learned the game about 10-12 years ago, while they all played it in high school, ~15 years ago. As I was the new guy, I actually downloaded and printed the entire rules for reference, I looked up cards I played on Gatherer for rulings and legality, to make sure I knew my shit, I read articles, consulted countless lists of decks, etc... I probably went overboard, but then again, I guess I'm 'that guy'... Anyhow, as I mentioned in my original post, if I try to let someone know he's doing a bad move (the kind of move you'd note with a big fat '?', in chess), I become 'that guy' again. So I can't help them get better. If I suggest we use a 'combat token' so the same guy (me) can't be attacked by everyone, every turn, I'm 'that guy' again.

I've tried toning down, playing budget, shutting up the entire night (again, they didn't like it...), being sober, being drunk, being high, smiling, having a poker face, etc... As soon as someone has removal, and I have anything on the board, I'm the target. I should really be using the past tense, since I haven't played those guys in years, and as was mentioned, I made other friends I can play with and have tons of fun, but this 'deck' (article/blog) struck a nerve, I guess, and opened old wounds or something, and reminded me of how painful it is to play against people who 'only' want to have fun, with little regards for the spirit of the game.

I know how pretentious both of my posts make me sound (and I'll admit to a mild obsessive/compulsive disorder...), but if I was really 'that guy', I figure I would have the same issues with other groups, which isn't the case. Heck, when they talked about buying a box of boosters of a new series, I mentioned having a draft tournament (as opposed to simply opening each booster) and, you guessed it, I was 'that guy' again.

In the end, we decided to simply stop playing together and remain friends, and it's probably better that way. Some people are just too casual for me, I guess, just like they'd say people like me are too serious for them, I figure.

Cheers. It feels good just to get it off my chest... ;P

Edit: Oh, and for the record, as far as rule #2 is concerned, I don't ever play infinite combos in MP (even my 'good' decks I only play if requested, if people want to try to team up against me, which is probably why they all want revenge when I play 'normal' decks...). The only such combo I have that I can think of, is an Umbral Mantle which can give infinite mana when equipped on an Elvish Archdruid, to pump up an infinite Joraga Warcaller, but I never used it, and when I play that deck for fun, I swap the Mantles out... I only put them in if I'm playing another 'infinite combo' deck, in a duel.

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 08:21

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Let them play with your decks sometimes and they will be forced to shupt up. Especially if they do poorly because it still needs playing skills to pilot good decks as well as politics. Similarily, offer to play their decks and offer help to improve their decks (within their card pool). That (hopefully) teaches them a lesson or two.
If that doesn't work, maybe search for less idiotic players.

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 13:49

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I got you! That makes much more sense. I'm sorry you can't seem to make a multiplayer night work with your friends. Check out my politics deck (on the hot page). This will make everyone WANT to keep you alive! Try making some decks like that perhaps. I feel for you as I know what its like to be with people playing magic who are annoying like that. Happy I gave you the chance to vent!

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 15:22

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@Puschkin: I did all of that, from 'trading decks' to letting them win on purpose while trying not to make it so obvious. The latter worked to some extent, but wasn't anymore fun to me... Great suggestions, still, in the end, I went for the last and found less idiotic players. I even invited some of the old guys to play with our new group, figuring their little 'alliance' wouldn't stand if they weren't playing on their turf, or that, at least, I'd also have people to side with me. In the end, they never showed up, I guess they figured I'd be out for revenge or something, and truth be told, I was. We even had an Un-deck we were going to play just to mess with them (all in good fun), the intent being to turn the tables on them and see how they like not being able to play the game for 5 hours...

@BigGeorge: Yeah, I saw it earlier this week, looks like a fun little deck, I might consider something like it. Actually, my lack of a strong MP deck is probably what was most frustrating in all of this. I mean, it's hard to blame people for attacking me when that's pretty much the point of the game, but it really came to a point where no matter what I played, I felt like I wasn't even playing. I did search for cards with 'each opponent' and 'any time someone/anyone' (any keyword string I figured would lead me to great MP cards) and looked up tons of decks, cards and ideas, built myself a pretty decent 'paper deck', but then figured... Why bother, they'll just say I built another OP deck so I could beat them again. In any case, I have no interest playing them again, like I said, we're still good friends, and we agreed we'd better not play MTG together. In fact, some of the people I play with now, have also played with some of 'them' and also had issues.

Reading all your 'Rules' again, I think it's the rule 13 that is the most relevant here. I'm big on diplomacy, psychology and anything that has me running my mouth to get into my opponents' head. That's one thing I was notified they didn't like, but as was mentioned in my other posts, it's pretty obvious that they had their own little diplomacy going on against me.

One argument I already alluded to literally was about my friend using his Norritt+Royal combo to tap and kill everything (which isn't a problem in itself, although pretty annoying), and my argument was on his 'killing priority', since his GF had a Simic Manipulator on the board (1 counter away from stealing his Royal or Norritt permanently...), another guy had a Vitu-Gazi Guildmage (playing a token deck), and yet, he went for my Llanowar Elf... I try explaining how next turn, he'll start getting overwhelmed by 3/3 Centaurs and/or lose part of his combo to the Manipulator. Nothing gives, he starts being mad at me for trying to tell him how to play, trying to manipulate him to my advantage, while his GF is mad I 'tried' to pit her BF against her, and the Token Deck guy is mad I 'tried' to break his combo before it got out of hand. And obviously, since the Royal is only killing my shit, no one bothers killing the Royal either, but they have a counter for my removal, if I try to use any on it... End result, they gang up on me and I die while everyone else has 20 lives and no permanent in their GY... And I'm the jerk for not taking it with a smile, the Xth time around.

Anyhow, I'm over it, like I said, it's been years and we're still good friends outside the game, but many of your rules can work both ways, in some contexts. I mean, I had so much issues getting them to get the actual WRITTEN rules, I certainly wouldn't even try having them read this article and have to consider 'UNWRITTEN' rules, too.

Don't get me wrong, it's a great post you wrote (which led to interesting discussions, from what I've read above, too), just that some rules don't apply the same with everyone.

Edit: For the record, here are some decks I like to play in MP games (you might notice I like tribal)...

http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/legendary-shogunate/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/krenkos-mob/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/grave-goblins/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/isochronic-simic/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/dark-elves-of-the-frost-2/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/ferocious-artifacts/ (my current deck)

...and some I'd never play (at least, not in their current form)...

http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/wizards-of-the-draw/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/food-chain-goblins/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/elvish-symbiosis/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/discard-to-win/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/cuntroll/
http://www.mtgvault.com/panik8/decks/suicide-circle/

...if there's anything you think doesn't abide by your rules (from the first group, obviously), please do let me know (some sideboards have 20 cards, since sleeve packs often come by packs of 80..., disregard that, but do notice how some decks have the best cards sideboarded, ie.: toned down). The second group is there to show how/what I figure are decks I own that aren't fun to play against (or to play at all, for me).

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 16:12

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The Krenko deck is very straight-forward (and Krenko itself ridiculous - I grew up with Goblin Warrens ...) but to my experience that's how most decks are built these days. Just that you know your stuff and don't built odd mana curves and so on.

And that Isochron deck might be tame for a deck with Iso Scepter but it's still annoying and you can't blame anyone going for the guy with an Iso out. Also, that deck isn't a MP deck in my eyes. It's way too fast. It HAS to play offensive and they only way to keep up with other, slower decks is to either kill fast or to get very annoying and controllish with it. It doesn't matter that you picked Runesnag instead of Counterspell (or Mana Drain for that matter), counter on a Iso is counter on a Iso. I haven't checked all of your decks but if they are similar like this one, I can understand part of the hatred and a basic urge to see you out first.

Anyway, your stories are a prime example because I really, really despise any multiplayer games with free-for-all win conditions (3 players being the exception). Next time someone asks me why, I'll just post a link to your posts here. Maybe the situation could have been remedied for you and them if you had played other formats like 2HG, Emperor or Pentagram.

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 17:14

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The first two decks seem lacking to me in a multiplayer game. They are light on removal of threats, which is a big thing in multiplayer. In the Bushido deck the stud of it is 8-and-a-half tails. That card can be a beast in multiplayer. I'd find a away to cast it , and add some removal to that deck. The Goblin deck is a dueling deck very fast early, it may be why people are attacking you. You are pinging at them early with a fast Goblin deck which makes enemies. The elf deck I'm loving for multiplayer, I have a similar one made on this site. However, it lacks removal as well. Your discard deck: BEGS to get attacked first and early. Very little win power and more of an annoyance. I'd attack you first if you played that deck as well. The next deck I stopped reading and thinking when I saw Stasis. That card is a major violator of rule seven, in fact I'm going to add it to rule # 7 LOL. And your artifact deck is pretty cool but again, very fast. You are making yourself a target by attacking early.

I agree totally with Puschkin, maybe a different format than free for all would work better for you! I'll look at the other decks and make suggestions when I get some more time.

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 18:07

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Well, I wasn't really seeking deck suggestions, I mean, I appreciate the input, but I just wanted to know if they were so bad and I know they're definetly not tweaked for MP, which is my whole point for linking them (the first ones), and I agree that Isochron is always annoying, but then again, who doesn't run artifact removal, these days? Everything is annoying if you can't deal with it, and I can think of many things way worse than a Counter to couple with Isochron... ;) As for the last decks I linked, yeah, they're good examples of decks I'd expect to generate hate against me, but like I said, they're relic of the past I keep just for show.

And I completely agree with you guys, that a different format would work better, I have no clue why they're so bent on playing FFA when 2HD, Emperor and Pentagram all are formats that have proven to provide a better playing experience for MP games. But, they're not really open to the idea of being restricted in who they can attack. Then again, it's been so long, maybe they changed, I might bring MTG up next time we meet, and I'll try to keep your advice in mind :)

It does make sense that by playing duel decks in MP format, I'd make enemies early and get attacked, which still doesn't make much sense if it lets other people become monsters from being left alone too long, but I guess I understand their side of the coin better, now.

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 19:23

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They most likely prefer FFA precisely because there "diplomatics" (ganging up) decides who wins and not the quality of decks or playing skills.

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Posted 18 October 2014 at 11:11

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What is Pentagram?

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Posted 19 October 2014 at 22:55

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5 Players. All of them are opponents and you can attack everyone (even split up attacks). Like free for all. But a player wins if the two players on the other side of the table are dead. It doesn't matter who killed them!

Look at the back of a magic card. Lets say each colour is a player. White wins if black and red are dead. It is possible that two players share a win. Lets say black dies first. Then green dies. Now it's basically white and blue vs red and if red dies, both blue and white win. However, the beauty of this is that there is always the possibility that a player wants to win alone. So, blue might try to kill white first and then red, winning alone. And that gives red a chance to win as well.

That's why this is the king of multiplayer formats. One where diplomacy is certainly needed but doesn't boil down to "let's all gang up on the player we like the least" - everybody has a defined goal how to win and it involves killing different players. Try it. After a while you will never want to play with more or less than 5 people.

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Posted 23 October 2014 at 19:17

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6inWWTwqDGo&feature=youtu.be

Your thoughts on this?

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Posted 12 October 2014 at 17:30

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I'll check it out when I get some time ;)

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 01:04

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Well that was an interesting and informative video, never had heard of all those alternate drafts before. Also any combination of the above should be a given, and isn't really needed on that list. Like a game of EDH, vangaurd, two headed giant, emperor, that took awhile would do again. I have nothing else constructive or intelligent to add. As such here is my rebuttal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDewQghHyLQ just beware, what you see will confuse you, its also got nothing to do with magic. Look ma I can post links too!

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 06:07

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Here is multiplayer budget deck number 2! Check it out: http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/seals-of-the-apocalypse-bgt/

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 01:04

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I put together a mono black budget multiplayer deck
http://www.mtgvault.com/vaan104/decks/budget-multiplayer/

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 02:26

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cool I'll check it out!

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Posted 13 October 2014 at 02:31

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speaking of multiplayer decks, cultural exchange would be a fun mp card. I was thinking swapping something that has a negative effect? Like Lich or Force of Nature or something.

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Posted 14 October 2014 at 03:11

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I'm so very happy at all of the interest and helpful comments on this post. Hopefully, I can continue to add some help to people looking for multiplayer decks. Again, I search multiplayer tags for decks daily. I give a free like to them (unless its just atrocious) as well as commenting in a helpful way. Finally, all those that supported this deck please support and look at my new decks that I created. All are multiplayer and most are under a budget theme of $30 or less.

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Posted 14 October 2014 at 03:58

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Check out my latest multiplayer budget deck!
http://www.mtgvault.com/biggeorge76/decks/multifact-budget/

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Posted 18 October 2014 at 03:32

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Can't do the link.
Says name changed or deleted.
I was willing to check it out!

Mind checking this one out, while you are redoing/retyping your link?

http://www.mtgvault.com/jessie/decks/it-bogles-the-mind/

Issues with it:
1) Do i need the mana ramp.
2) Has no 2nd win condition.

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Posted 18 October 2014 at 03:45

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Done! Thanks

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Posted 19 October 2014 at 05:53

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dharr16 has deleted this comment.

Posted 20 October 2014 at 05:22

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Since this is a "How to.." page I don't feel as bad about asking for assistance.. I'm wanting to make a deck around Bazaar Trader, but i want it to be usable in free for all as well as two-headed giant. Or at least set the sb up to where its interchangeable for the two. I know there's positive cards like lich's mirror and the such, but I'm also looking for cards that would hinder your opponents once you turned over possession. I've came up with a couple and I was just hoping for some ideas, and possibly some feedback?

http://www.mtgvault.com/dharr16/decks/the-bazaar-again/

http://www.mtgvault.com/dharr16/decks/the-bazaar/

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Posted 20 October 2014 at 05:22

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Sure thing, I'd be happy to. Initial reactions to your deck seems like a violator of rule #2 :D. Basically, you give them the Immortal Coil w/Bazar Trader, they take damage because you've removed their graveyard, and they die? This has a few issues: How to you plan on giving them that one damage? Also, your stuff is VERY vulnerable. Sure maybe first time they don't see it coming but in a FFA game your stuff is getting destroyed ASAP and you have no way to bring it back. I'm thinking the deck as it stands isn't going to do well in a FFA environment and may struggle in 2HG. Definitely love the originality and the "coolness" of the combo, but in my opinion is going to have some difficulties winning. When I get home I'll make a budget multiplayer deck based around Bazar Trader and hopefully it will give you some ideas!

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Posted 20 October 2014 at 17:06

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wat duz this deck specilize in?

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Posted 23 October 2014 at 18:07

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It's not a deck, it is a how too guide

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Posted 23 October 2014 at 18:15

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k:)thx

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Posted 23 October 2014 at 18:19

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is there a point to the choice of cards in this fake deck?
btw very helpful:)

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Posted 07 November 2014 at 18:12

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Read the deck description and How to Play section please.

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Posted 07 November 2014 at 19:28

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ah. thank you very much. If you want a more aggressive playstyle, are there any decks that work more effectively in larger games than in 2-player?

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Posted 11 November 2014 at 20:34

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Certainly, yes. It's not easy and depends on what kind of multiplayer (free-for-all is the worst for any aggressive deck), but it is possible. Here is one of mine, specifically built to play aggressive in multiplayer environments that is a bit slower than a 1-on-1 deck but won't run out of steam, even if everybody is packed with removal:
http://www.mtgvault.com/puschkin/decks/pump-up-the-wham/

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Posted 11 November 2014 at 23:04

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http://www.mtgvault.com/kjsj3/decks/jund-fun-stuffs/

Found an old modern deck that I'd been working on. While its original intention was to play competitively at fnm, it does fairly well at multi-player games.

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Posted 11 November 2014 at 22:20

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I decided to try making my own variant on the ideas show above, so i made this. Not as pacifist as many may prefer, but it is effective.

http://www.mtgvault.com/planeswalker999/decks/awesome-multiplayer/

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Posted 12 November 2014 at 21:10

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Posted 04 December 2014 at 08:07

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Posted 04 December 2014 at 08:24

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"My fun isn't dependent on you and neither is yours dependent on me."
This is completely untrue, especially in multiplayer. Magic is like sex, you need at least two participants and if nobody cares for the desires of the others, the result might still be sex, but it will be horrible sex. And when you play lame combos (especially those without interaction) then that's like jerking off and cumming into the face of everyone else. So, unless you find someone that likes jizz in his face it is YOU that has to fuck off and go somewhere else, not the group! Magic is a social game and if you enforce your way, it is X players that don't have fun. If you want to be that guy, you ruined the game or evening for everyone. Because even if you or the people that dont like your way leave, you won't have enough players left.

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Posted 04 December 2014 at 08:46

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Posted 04 December 2014 at 09:09

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This kind of attitude has it's place: Tournaments. Which multiplayer certainly isn't. And people with a mindset like yours are better off attending tournaments. Often times they still try their hands on multiplayer - for exactly this reason this list was made.
Otoh (as I wrote in my reply to this thread way up the comments) if you need to explain why combos are bad fpor multiplayer, chances are that players like you really, really don't grasp the concept of what it is like to play a game socially instead of competitively. Which ultimately means they'll never understand.

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Posted 04 December 2014 at 13:44

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Ya I'm not trying to tell anyone what to do. I just wanted to write a fun post, drum up some interest in multiplayer, and share some of my 24 years of experiences playing multiplayer magic(almost exclusively non competitively). I would comment further, but Puschkin pretty much nailed it, and quite hilariously at that!

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Posted 05 December 2014 at 16:47

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hey, i'm making a pair of decks for a semi-casual 2-headed-giant tournament next week. to this end, my partner is running laboratory maniac/self-mill. i'm running blue-black-white control with some mill that targets my partner and utilizes the grey merchant of ashpodel (gary) as an alternate win con. my deck of the 2 will be up momentarily. please help?

currently it's only blue-white, so adding black is the tricky part i need help with. gary is to good to pass up:)
http://www.mtgvault.com/planeswalker999/decks/controlmill-2hg-deck/

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Posted 12 December 2014 at 17:55

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The true meta from my experience the best deck is a very little creature stupid amount of lifeguard deck filled with boardrooms and exiles, but please comment so I can see what you people use

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Posted 22 June 2020 at 16:17

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Nice gem from 2014

Those old posts really underline a time where people upvoted a lot more.

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Posted 22 June 2020 at 21:03

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I concur

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Posted 22 June 2020 at 21:07

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